Rugby TTL - Series 2 - Episode 2 -Rugby Europe Championship Highlights & Future Prospects

 Welcome to episode two of Rugby Through the League's Podcast Series Two. In this episode, host discusses the highs and lows of the Rugby Europe Championships, touching on standout teams and performances, such as Georgia's dominance and Spain's noteworthy second-place finish. Unfortunately, the scheduled guest commentator for Rugby Europe championships, Justin Middleton, had to cancel last minute. However, the episode delves deep into the potential future of Rugby Europe, the possible inclusion of teams like Spain and Georgia in the Six Nations, and the overall development of the sport across the continent. Additionally, upcoming episodes and interviews with notable figures like Simon Middleton are teased, setting the stage for more engaging content. Don't forget to subscribe, like, and comment to stay updated with all things rugby. 

00:00 Welcome to Episode Two 

00:21 Rugby Europe Championships Recap 

00:52 Spain's Standout Performance 

02:47 Future of Rugby Europe Championships 

03:07 Six Nations and Emerging Nations 

05:46 Spain and Georgia's Aspirations 

07:53 Challenges for Spanish Rugby 

12:41 URC and Black Lions 

17:34 Promotion and Relegation in Rugby Europe 

25:21 Women's Rugby Europe Championships 

30:27 Future of Rugby Europe and Six Nations 

37:01 Conclusion and Upcoming Episodes 

Transcript

Series 2 Episode 2

[00:00:00] Hello and , welcome to episode two of Rugby through the League's Podcast series two. We originally had Justin Middleton, , who's the commentator for majority of the Rugby Europe championships. , Unfortunately scheduled him quite fit again, he had to cancel last minute, so you're sadly stuck with me.

, But we're gonna continue and talk about Rugby Europe and. Obviously the, the pleasure that I had of sort of being able to go and be pitch side from quite a few of the Spain games alongside all things rugby and everything they've managed to, to help rugby TTL with and I was able to spread the word about rugby Europe.

So yeah, it was really good fun. Really, really good championships as well. So obviously standout, probably standout performers. Apart from obviously Georgia just dominating again, uh, it was obviously, probably Spain. Uh, managed to get a [00:01:00] really, really good second place finish going to Portugal. Beating Portugal on, uh, on one of Portugal's off days.

Obviously managing to get a decent result in the opening game against, um, obviously the Netherlands. A bit of a difficult trip to Switzerland do. Another standout probably was probably how good Switzerland got Towards the end, they got better as the tournament went on. So really big shout out to how Switzerland managed to come back from that heavy, heavy, heavy defeat at the start of the tournament.

So really, really good fun, really good tournament, and obviously a lot of people keep talking about. The Six Nations. But first, let's make sure you subscribe, like follow us on every platform that you physically can to make sure you get more of this content moving forward. Uh, next week's episode is Simon [00:02:00] Middleton, ex England women's Manager.

So we manage to discuss a lot of, uh, his career. The, that World Cup final and obviously what he now currently does with world Rugby and emerging nations as well. So that's really, really good interview coming up with, with Simon. So make sure you like, subscribe and follow and obviously drop a comment for any bits you like and tell us the bits you don't so that we can make sure it is better for everyone that is watching.

So let's get back to the Rugby Europe championships and. The trophy, obviously we've got the conference. We've got the Women's Rugby Europe Championship, which has just come to an end as well. So Rugby Europe championships. Where do we go forward with this? Because the product is there, but how far will it be allowed to continue?

How far does the Rugby Europe [00:03:00] Championships grow? Is there any way for the likes of Spain and. Um, Georgia to, to enter into the Six Nations. I think brutally honest, no, I think that is a closed shop that is very much Six Nations is a Six Nations, a lot of prestige around it and it's not gonna have the door opened.

So I think we've gotta look at another option around. Developing rugby into, into that sphere. And it's not gonna come in the form of the six nations, in my opinion. however I could be wrong because the under eighteens six nations at the minute is classed as a festival. So they've managed to invite Georgia and Spain into the under eighteens, and Spain actually managed to beat.

Scotland the other day as well. So they managed to turn over Scotland and they went in equal halftime [00:04:00] against England as well. So that was 12 or half time England managed to pull away in the second half. So maybe that's a glimpse into the future, but as as it states, its class as a festival. I can't see the six nations being divulged to anyone else.

Um, especially on the men's level, potentially the women's, um, which also discussed with, with Simon as well. Uh, there's, there's probably a slightly more adaptable door opening policy for, for the six nations for at a women's aspect, but. Um, his opinion of, of that as well was really, really good statement of, of where that development within women's rugby is gonna come.

So make sure you catch that one next week. But Six Nations rugby, he's not probably gonna see Georgia and Spain. I think the best [00:05:00] format is potentially a, as I've said in a previous article I wrote. A Euro championship style where we're able to incorporate more of the nations and the tier ones become involved in that is similar to like a World Cup qualifier process, which is done in football or euros or, or a nations league.

But obviously there's the, the stalwarts that wanna keep the. The, the Summer internationals, I think probably the easiest one to adapt around would be an Autumn Internationals and allow that Autumn series to have a little bit more of an impact upon rugby as a, as a whole. So, Spain, have obviously got big, big intentions as well with their 2035 World Cup bid, which we discussed last week with Adam and.

A few people commented upon that as well, and they'd like to see that as a joint bid with [00:06:00] Portugal. But again, that's a great, great step forward for Rugby Europe. I just don't see Spain wanting to share that at rugby, rugby level potentially, but I think that'd be a really good way of strengthening the bid rather than weakening it.

And then Georgia, obviously Georgia are now shouting for a URC place for their Black Lions. So obviously they're in the challenge cup. They're now shouting for a URC spot to to allow more game time. I think that might be off the back of Abutadsze saying that he wants to go and try and play at the top level.

So they're probably hoping that they're not going to lose a significant amount of their top talent that haven't already ventured into the top 14. Again, Spain have also followed up with that question for a entrant, [00:07:00] for, for, for, for a team. I, I don't think Spain or anywhere in the same realm. At the minute, at that level, um, we've got the Rugby Europe Super Cup coming up, um, which last year did not end very, very well for, for Spain with their representation with the, um, Castillo, Leon, uh, Iberians.

They finished bottom of their group a. With no wins against the black lions and the Lustianos, which is obviously from Portugal. So Spain are a different crossroads with having probably a, a representative team for the URC or the challenge cup at a bare minimum for what, what they're sort of asking. I don't think.

That is set up for [00:08:00] UN until the centralized contract is able to pull players back potentially. So you'd have to factor that around the Division de Honor and how they would select for the, for the, the Spanish representation on the iberians because you've then got to lean on clubs. Top 14 players, do they get called back to play challenge cup or is it just gonna be say, well actually we're only gonna include under twenties, under eighteens and a select few of unallocated senior players, but then the senior players don't manage to get enough game time, so they, they'll have to be loaned out during the rest of the season two Division de Honor teams, et cetera, which is not at the level.

That Spain rugby needs to progress, but with a successful 2035 [00:09:00] bid, I think that Division de Honor will grow and have to grow to, to create that further pathway for Spanish rugby. It's gonna cost money. It's gonna cost time. There's gonna have to be stadiums, there's gonna have to be a lot of work done. For Spanish rugby to grow in to what it could do.

Georgia and the Black Lions are obviously financially backed pretty well by, um, certain individuals who've got significant funds to, to support the development and not have the same concern of the commercial element of bringing in player, uh, players to, to the league. Whereas the Spanish League is a, is a mixture of.

Of players that are coming to try and play in Europe and also developing Spanish players, which is working so far. Like obviously the likes of Mario Pichardie, he's come, come through. He's obviously gone over to England, Matt Foulds, et [00:10:00] cetera, and. Players that have managed to go over to the top 14, uh, Lucian, Richardis, uh, and you've got Hugo, Hugo Pichardie, the, um, Mario's brother are all playing over in, uh, in France at the minute.

And on that precipice of some of the, some of the, some of the teams, some floating in and outta the first team, which is really, really positive. And then hopefully be. Progressing very well for, for the seniors, but I don't until that's potentially backed up with a, with a national league. Can you ask to put a team in the challenge cup like the Black Lions have as my opinion, I just, I can't see it happening for a couple of seasons, but a significant structure would need to be put in place to make sure that that team is.

Significantly sourced. Most of the players that were in the, the Iberian [00:11:00] side haven't been in or around the, the Rugby Europe conversation this time round. So is it players that have made it past or is it players that are making it into the future? That would have to be how we, we see it. But you'd still want to have.

Significant representation for players that can make sure they are part of the, the national setup, similar to, to the Black Lions, to to support a development of a challenge Cup. Or do you go whoever wins the Division de honor that season or the, the Copa del Rey and put them into the challenge cup. Which would be a really interesting way to try and drive progression within the the game.

And I think that would probably be my preference is you finish top of the Spanish division de Honor or the, or the Copa del Rey or et cetera, how about, or a bit of playoff between the two. If it's two different teams and they get to qualify for the challenge, cup the [00:12:00] season after. That'd be a really interesting way of improving.

The club game at that level, I believe, and, and obviously we're gonna have players that are playing in the top 14. We've got players that are gonna be playing in the Champions Cup already in the Challenge Cup at other levels. So does that then bring players back to Spanish rugby at the Division de Honor level to, to allow them to target Challenge Cup and European rugby?

That would be a really, really positive. Spin onto Division de Honor and really interesting to to see. So that'd be one I'm gonna keep abreast of and hopefully we can find out how that's gonna pan out. 'cause again, I can't see the URC allowing the Black Lion team in. I think it would be really interesting to add to it and it'd be another really positive move for Georgian rugby.

I just can't see how they add that to the mix. Again, the travel [00:13:00] to Georgia adds on a lot of issues to a lot of clubs. Obviously it's already difficult enough for a lot of clubs to travel to

down to South Africa. but that's one flight. It's just a long flight and most clubs sacrifice certain travel. You add Georgia into the mix and you've then got two flights, stopovers extra travel for. Game weeks, it'd be a benefit for Black Lion. 'cause obviously they'll have certain teams turning up that don't want to play or haven't been able to travel as well as others and potentially be able to pick up some points there.

So that'd be really interesting to see how the Black Lion would benefit and also potentially hamper them. But they're used to the travel with the multiple flights in and outta different places to get out of. Uh, Georgia, or they're playing, uh, or living in certain other areas. So yeah, it'd be really interesting to, to see how the URC could grow.

It wouldn't, I can't see it happening, [00:14:00] but that would probably be the first part of progression for Georgian rugby. And that's probably the earliest, the only conversational commercial piece that they'll be able to have is with the URC to add that. The j the Six Nations is, is a closed shop, I believe.

And I do agree with a lot of the, the conversations. A lot of people are saying that it is what it is and that's how that is. People buy into it, et cetera. And I, unless people are willing to put their open, open the checkbooks and there's that money, but I just, I, I think that is a closed conversation. I think you've gotta look at an another.

Another tournament or make the Autumn series more important on a sort of a European slash tier two basis. Like you could also throw Japan, Fiji into the mix. And, [00:15:00] but rugby Europe, for me and for for most people within Europe is potentially the. The passion that we want that to grow and allow them to have a punt at the top, the top teams.

And yeah, it was a bit of a transitional year for a lot of clubs for, uh, nations within the Rugby Europe championships. It was a great tournament, but it kind of disappointed on a certain level that there wasn't more jeopardy around. The qualification for the 2027 World Cup, uh, for the top four spots, the jeopardy come later on and fair play to Belgium for being able to, to step forward and take that that spot.

It kind of looked like it was gonna be a Netherlands, a Netherlands takeover, but Netherlands didn't. Turn up to the last game really. And Belgium saved the best of last. Well, they had the blinding game of the first game and then yeah, [00:16:00] kind of really switched it on for the last game and managed to take that fifth spot.

And in turn they've managed to take the trip to America as well. So they've replaced Netherlands and they're gonna go and travel to America to take on, uh, the USA. Over there and I can't remember their other game, but they've got two games rather than having to wait till the November internationals, uh, the World Cup qualifiers.

So yeah, it'd be really good to see how Belgium continue now that they've got a, an additional couple of games in the, in the summer. Spain are obviously traveling over there to, uh, to take on on the USA and Canada and. That'd be a really, really good game to to, to see both of them. Obviously, USA is quite a common game for, for Spain.

They've got a really good benchmark to progress the himself against there, so Canada's gonna be a difficult game as well for, for him. And we got Mario [00:17:00] Pichardie coming on, as I said in the, just before the tournament, uh, just before the, the summer tour. Um, so whether there's gonna be some rotation of players ahead to, to keep an eye on who's gonna be available for the 2027 World Cup as well now.

So four teams qualified Belgium throw himself into the mix for, for Rugby Europe to, to represent with potentially five, five teams, which will be amazing. And then, yeah, we've obviously got the next cycle starts next time round of. The promotion relegation for Rugby Europe. So yeah, we've obviously gotta talk about Germany.

They did not have the tournament they expected, and to be honest, how they started the tournament didn't expect it either. In my opinion. I didn't expect him to to end how it did, especially in such dramatic fashion against Switzerland and. [00:18:00] Yeah, last minute drop goal from, uh, from Switzerland was phenomenal to watching from a, from a rugby point of view, but heartbreaking for, for any German fans out there.

They, uh, they did not manage to field an unchanged side, I think throughout because a lot of injuries, a lot of tactical decisions were made throughout and. Yeah, it was very interesting to see how they did not manage to get a foothold in that tournament. And even when they got the lead against Switzerland, they threw it away and were, look, they looked really, really unsettled throughout that game.

So, yeah, really interesting. And we got Shawn Ingle lined up to come on and probably talk about that firsthand from within. So. I'll leave that probably more for, for the episode with Shawn, because he was a standout performer through, through that [00:19:00] tournament. It tackled everything and any, anything just, um, was not on the, the side was not, not with him.

And yeah, it was a really interesting one. The Netherlands obviously now changing their, their gaffer, so they're gonna be looking for the next step, progression ahead of, uh, next year. Promotion relegation, obviously the, the big one for next season with the finals, day usually decided for all, for four spots.

So you'd have the first, third, and fifth, and then the seventh playoffs all played on the DA the same day. So Germany and Switzerland, well, Switzerland obviously managed to, to pick Germany this time. Germany have obviously gotta make sure they don't get relegated, but a trophy. Rugby Europe trophy looks very, very, very competitive.

This, this season went down to the last game [00:20:00] between the top two sides. So we managed to witness Poland who got relegated last time out of the championship. They managed to take on , Sweden in the last game. Which saw Poland win 29 25 to pick up the title. So that is definitely, definitely gonna be a really interesting one to, to keep an eye on for next season for the promotion.

Relegation Luxembourg obviously had a blinding conference, um, last season, struggled. This time in the trophy finished on two points. Lithuania finished fifth on five. Croatia got six points in fourth, and then the top three sides. Obviously Poland finished top on 22. Sweden on 19 in second, and then Czechia finished fifth, sorry, third with 16 points.

So [00:21:00] it seems like a league of two halves there. And I wonder who can probably step. Into that, into that gap and close up, or is somebody gonna have a really bad season and drop out? Luxembourg obviously had their first dabble at that level and, uh, didn't do as well as they did in the conference last year.

So. Yeah, it'd be good fun to, to keep an eye on both of those next season, hopefully. Obviously we'll be able to go and see a little bit more of these games as well. So we've managed to get the championships covered. Looks like we're hopefully gonna be able to get across to the trophy and be able to follow it all the way through.

So men's conference is underway as well. Which, if you guys remember one of the first episodes I did, I managed to actually sit there and go through all of these, so it is broken up into pools and bracket. So pool A is currently headed up by Denmark. Then you got [00:22:00] on 14 points Latvia on 11 points in second, Finland in third on five points.

Norway and Estonia rock bottom on zero. In pool B, Ukraine are top on 10 points. Austria are second after only one game on five are third. With five points in Slovakia Rock, bottom on zero. Pool C is headed up by Moldova on 11 points, Turkey on five points in second. Serbia are third on four, and Bulgaria bottom at the minute on four as well.

So that's a really tight group there. In pool C. Pool D, we have got Malta top on 10 points, Andorra second on nine, Israel. On in third on five and Cyprus are bottom on zero. So the Cyprus Israel game, I believe, got canceled the other day as well. So that could all get mixed up [00:23:00] on how that happens, whether Israel having to pull out, and obviously they didn't manage to play last season.

There's a bit of a change in a guard in Cyprus as well, which the, the current head coach has, has managed his last game over there. So there's a bit of a transition and hopefully we can get Andrew Binikos on in, uh, in a few episodes time. We've gotta catch up with him at the end of the week to, to hopefully try and tie him, tie him into coming and telling everyone the story about Cyprus rugby.

So that'd be really, really exciting to get him on. On. And, uh. Find out how he got into it and where, where Cyprus Rugby's gonna move forward after his departure. And then Pool E, we've got Slovenia on uh, top on nine. Bosnia and Herzegovina, are second with nine. Uh, Montenegro are third on five points and Kosovo are bottom on zero.

So obviously they've moved up from the [00:24:00] development league that we talked about last season. So. We had a couple of real standout performances in recent weeks as well in the, in the conference with the top scores in the recent weeks, Ukraine won a won 86 10 against Hungary the other week, which was. A really good scoreline to, to see and ha and, and have that come across Bosnia.

won 77 10 against Kosovo, Latvia won 62 nil against Estonia Hungary 51 16 against Slovakia, Finland, 81 10 against Norway, Slovenia, won 74 10 against Kosovo. Denmark won 105 nil against Estonia. Um, so yeah, there's been some real big score lines in the, in the conference and probably some clear gaps of where [00:25:00] those clubs are and where that progression of that tournament is, and I'd be really exciting to see how that then pans out.

As that goes on, the, uh, the development doesn't seem to have progressed further past the Montenegro and Kosovo side, so that seems to, they've been molded into, into the conference now. So that is that over on the women's side, the women's championships has just come to an end and Sweden took on Netherlands at weekends.

That ended with a sizable Netherlands win of 90. Points to three in Sweden. The, uh, the championship was obviously won by Spain again. Um, got run close against the Netherlands the week before though. So they, they finished the tournament top, but on 13 points this time, uh, Netherlands, second on 10. Portugal finished third on [00:26:00] five, and then Sweden finished bottom on zero.

The women's trophy was won by. Belgium, which was a big shout out to, uh, what Belgium are trying to do as well. They've recently appointed one of our previous guests, Warren Abraham's, as part of their seven setup for the women's. So they're, they're really trying to push forward Belgium, obviously the men's of.

Managed to to get a good result and get himself in the chance for a World Cup qualifier. And they've got a clear path of how they want to develop rugby in Belgium at the minute by the seems of it. So it'd be really good to see how that continues. So they managed to finish top on nine points. Germany Women's finished second on sixth, and then Finland finished third on zero.

So there's only three teams in the women's trophy. So it'd be be good to see how these other countries are able to start progressing because the, the women's [00:27:00] championships looks like it needs a bit more of a couple of teams in there just to try and expand that. But obviously they're trying not to make sure they weaken the rest of it.

And then the, uh, the women's Conference has got just two teams in, it's in Norway and Latvia, which they play in the middle of May. So if, uh, if anyone wants to pop to Norway and watch Norway, Latvia, that would be on the 10th of May. So that'd be another one to hopefully see how they merge a trophy in the conference and whether we can get one big.

Women's Europe Championships moving forward as well. 'cause that'll be a really good way to step the game forward, especially with the, the World Cup being this year as well. And Spain obviously managing to make it across. But the, I think the big standout recently for me, in my personal opinion, was the, the [00:28:00] statement.

Within Spanish rugby of how they're now actually trying to put it on the map. It's been a big enough game within certain parts for a long period of time, but it now seems to be ready to kick on. And the interest obviously is, is is there. So I went on Huw's episodes, uh, on his, on his podcast as well, and.

That's now become one of his, that's become his highest viewed episode that he's ever recorded. Uh, so it shows that there's a clear demand for Spanish rugby or especially around rugby Europe, hopefully. And whether Spain are gonna be the leader in that, that's probably the way forward because Georgia or Georgia, Georgia.

Everyone knows Georgia, but I think there's a bit of a,

there's a bit of a stigma around Georgia. A lot of [00:29:00] people don't seem to be as vocal supporters against them. Uh, for them. I think there's, there seems to be a lot of, a lot of opinions that wanna hold them back, which I don't think anyone within rugby should hold anyone back if they're, if they're playing good enough rugby for everyone, it's.

We need to find a way of making it marketable for, for all, and we're not in a place of the game to be able to turn any viewers, commercialization, fans, any way of improving or extending the game to, to more, I don't think we're in a position to be able to sort of turn that away. So. Georgia's got to, we've gotta find a way of allowing Georgia to continue to progress.

Like they're probably a sort of a what, potentially a 1.5 tier nation, same as Fiji. They're not, they're probably slightly too good for tier two, but [00:30:00] they're potentially not good enough for tier one yet. But you can only improve by playing the best. And if they don't get the option to play the best, then how can we.

Allow the game to continue. And I don't, it's not gonna be the Six Nations. We know that it's the Autumn Internationals has gotta take more of an importance for me, uh, for my opinion. That's gonna be our only way to move the game forward. And

Rugby Europe has got a great product. We've got a really, really great product to, to go and see. In, in the game and it's really exciting to see these other nations coming through. Like the list that we just read, read, read off there. Imagine some of them are on away day, like if you got Chance England are gonna go play Cyprus.

How many people would be on their way to Cyprus just to go and watch England play and England football fans get this [00:31:00] option a lot. Through those sort of games and they get to go and explore and see other cultures, other nations, other ways of football. Is that something that we miss in rugby or have we just gotta constantly keep going to the same places, which we could get the best of both worlds.

We could get those same places and also a little bit more if you are able to open a door and say, actually we're gonna go and. Play these, these games and we're going end up England, get drawn against Latvia and stuff that it's gonna be significantly one sided for a very, very long time. But that's no different to what's happening in the Women's Six Nations at the minute.

With England, they are so dominant within that space that is not gonna change for, for a period of time either. So is that. Is that okay? Are we just gonna leave that as that brand and that will grow its own way? I think they'll [00:32:00] probably be more adaptable to add other teams, like be really good to see Spain and say like the Netherlands.

Uh, added in to a Women's Six Nations Festival style, similar to what the under eighteens have done. Maybe that is what the Under Eighteens Six Nations Festival is. Maybe this is a pre-pilot to what. They have planned to and Georgia and Spain or Portugal, Spain or Georgia, there's, there must be some of a plan down the line.

They can't have just come up with this festival idea and then thought it's not gonna, it's only gonna be able to be played at under eighteens. Does that under eighteens then become an under twenties in two years time when those under eighteens are at that level? And then is the natural progression for that to become a a senior Six Nations festival?

Is, is this something that World Rugby [00:33:00] haven't come up with or Six Nations haven't announced that this is how they've got the, the pathway, which will be? I, I think from what I've seen and what I've watched is a really, really good product to rugby. Spain obviously add a very exciting way of playing rugby.

Georgia, play rugby as Georgia do, and they have added Georgia nearly picked Wales in the, in the under eighteens six nations as well the other day. So

there is, maybe it's a trial. It'd be great to see if that is. What they're trying to create. But they've done, they've had to do that at a festival base. So they've picked, Vichy, in France. So is it one of those that you've gotta hold it as a festival tournament or can we find a way of making it that you get to go and experience these other places?

[00:34:00] Because I, I think that's what adds. The fun and excitement to the six Nations is that you get to rotate where you go every couple of years and I think it's a really good fun to allow us to go and play, watch rugby, and see rugby in different, different places. I love going to Rome, what to watch. England obviously gonna Scotland's brilliant and um, obviously Wales.

What a stadium, what an atmosphere. Why can't we find that elsewhere? Why can't we go and showcase those sort of atmospheres to other state? Other places like Spain had a really, really good atmosphere. Portugal's great fun, really, really passionate fans as well. And I think if you added the mix of England or Wales, .

Going to certain nations like that, it would be a really good advert. And we'll find out that in, in the summer as well, actually. 'cause Portugal are hosting Ireland in July in [00:35:00] the Estadio Nacional, uh, where I went for the, the Portugal Spain game. And what a stadium, what a place and what a spectacle that would be to put Portugal against Ireland in Lisbon in July.

It'll be. A great spectacle. The only problem at the minute, you can't drink in a stadium in Portugal, so there's no alcohol. So I know they're having to try and resolve that pretty sharply. 'cause not being able to drink in a, in a rugby stadium is, uh, is, is probably a slightly different culture to, to what happens in a lot of places.

So it'd be great fun to see Ireland take on Portugal. Hoping it's, it is, it will be still a fairly competitive Irish side, but it's not gonna be anywhere near the level that would be attending. But they probably wouldn't be attending that, that game if it wasn't Lions season. And, uh, yeah, [00:36:00] it's, um, it's a really exciting time for Rugby Europe.

Next season's gonna get more tasty as well, obviously with the promotion relegation. And I don't wanna ramble on too much because I've always really been a big enough advocate. This is probably gonna be a quick one in that sense, but

what is everyone's opinion on the Six Nations? Is it, is it got to be left as locked? Is it. One that we can open the door or do we trial it at younger age groups and then bring it into fruition as it as it grows, or keep it there. Keep you, uh, make sure you keep that as the six nations. Leave it as that.

And then we, uh, we develop a, a tournament or has other people got other ideas? 'cause there's, there's gotta be a lot of different. Ways of skilling a cat potentially. And other people have got different ideas and it'd be great to hear what everyone's opinion is on that. And yeah, so hopefully everyone's gathered where we [00:37:00] are in Rugby Europe.

It was, um, obviously planned for having Justin Middleton on, and, and we could have discussed it more in depth, but next week's a blinder. We've got Simon Middleton on great guest get to talk about. Women's rugby, where he is been, what he's done, and we have got guests lined up for quite a while now. So don't worry, there's not gonna be too many more times.

I left a ramble. Potentially there is a, we are hopefully lining up a potential special episode to discuss another subject within grassroots rugby. So keep an eye out for that. That one's gonna come out as an add-on and we're just finalizing the last bits on that. And yeah, obviously. Thanks for listening.

It's not quite the episode we planned, but we have got Justin line backed up to, to come back on. Make sure you subscribe, like follow, drop. A comment about [00:38:00] what I said at the end there. What's your opinions on the Six Nations? What's your opinions on. How do we add tier two nations into a format? Or do we just leave rugby Europe as it is and then let those players, those teams go and fight it out at the World Cup if they ever qualify.

So it'd be great to hear your opinions around that and just make sure you carry on sharing the love, love the game preseasons out there now. So those that haven't. Got back to play on rugby. Get back and hopefully we'll get to catch you in the next episode. Thank you and goodbye.