Episode 20 - The Lexi Chambers Interview - From John O'Groats to Lands End for the End 2 End Rugby Relay

Lexi Chambers, a wheelchair-dependent athlete, is embarking on a challenge to wheel from John O'Groats to Land's End in a rugby relay. She aims to raise awareness for women's rugby and inspire others to get involved in sports. Lexi shares her journey of becoming wheelchair-dependent and her passion for rugby. She has set multiple world records in wheelchair racing and has trained extensively for her current challenge. Lexi's support crew includes her coach and fellow rugby players. They have planned the route carefully, ensuring accommodations and necessary supplies along the way. Lexi shares the stops along her journey and invites people to come and support her. She mentions the clubs she will be visiting, including Ross Sutherland, Glasgow Warriors, Carlisle Cougars, and more. Lexi also talks about the significance of each club keeping a rugby ball signed by the previous team and passing it on to the next team. She emphasizes the importance of connecting grassroots and professional rugby to allow people to fall in love with the game. Lexi discusses the challenges faced by women's rugby and the need for more exposure and support. She mentions the positive impact of social media and the role of local clubs and mainstream platforms in promoting the game. Carl suggests implementing initiatives like discounted tickets for kids to make the game more accessible and attract new fans. The conversation explores the challenges and opportunities in promoting women's rugby and growing the game. The lack of publicity and marketing for the women's game is highlighted, with a focus on the need for players to have individual brands and identities. The conversation also touches on the importance of schools in closing the gap and introducing more young people to the sport. The role of social media in promoting the women's game is discussed, as well as the need for more awareness and dispelling of myths surrounding the sport. The conversation concludes with a discussion of Lexi's upcoming world record attempt and her plans for future challenges. Lexi discusses her plans to document her wheelchair journey across the UK, including live tracking and daily videos. She talks about the challenges of wheeling in different weather conditions and the importance of finding the right gear, such as waterproof gloves. Lexi also shares her training routine, which includes marathons, track sessions, and gym workouts. She mentions her desire to walk again and potentially wear a prosthetic in the future. The conversation ends with a discussion about promoting Lexi's journey and supporting her cause.

Transcript

Rugby Through The Leagues (00:12)
Hello and welcome to the next episode of Rugby Through the Leagues podcast. As you can see, we are still in England. There is a bit of sunshine. The mighty Gosport is in the background there. This week we've got the amazing Lexi Chambers on, obviously embarking on an end -to -end rugby challenge. This is a long one, so I'm not going to dawdle along with this episode intro. So let's get on with it. This is a cracker.

Carl (00:39)
Right, so this week we've got Lexi Chambers on. So for those that don't know, she's kind of a big deal. She's got a few world records to her name and now deciding to embark on upon another as you do, because obviously one's not enough. So you're targeting five at the minute. So you've got to go for it. So Lexi, thank you so much for your time. Really, really appreciate it. I know you're just in prep mode ready for the...

for the actual journey and the challenge next week. So, Lexi, for those that aren't aware, can you just share your life story, where you've been, any involvement in the game, we'll obviously carry on. We've got a few questions to run through and hopefully enlighten everyone and tell them where they start raising some money as well.

Lexi (01:26)
Yeah, hi, and thank you so much for having me. Yeah, gosh, where do I start? So basically I'm wheelchair dependent. So I'm doing, I'm wheeling an ordinary wheelchair from John O 'Groats to Land's End, which hasn't been done before. And I decided to make it into a rugby relay. So it's basically called end to end rugby relay, for obvious reasons.

Carl (01:40)
you do.

Lexi (01:51)
So what the premise is, is I'm going to be taking a ball. So we're starting off at Exeter Chiefs which is where I live. And we're taking the ball to the first club in Scotland. And then we're going to be passing the ball from club to club to club all the way down the country. And basically, it's just to sort of demonstrate what most people within rugby already know. And it's showing the connectivity behind women's rugby and trying to get people to watch the game and to come to the games and be there. And it all started.

Well, quite a long time ago, really. I was in the army , years ago. I ended up with pain in my feet. It's quite a common thing called the hammer toes. I had a surgery on my left foot and my foot didn't get any better. The pain escalated over sort of eight years. I ended up with eight surgeries over eight years. And then after that, ended up electing to have my leg off below the knee, just to try and get rid of the pain that I was in.

Carl (02:26)
Okay.

Lexi (02:43)
And I found out just before that I had something called complex regional pain syndrome, which basically it's a fancy name for being in a massive ton of pain all the time. So if you kind of think about a sort of naught to 10 of like a pain scale, I live at a permanent eight out of 10, and that kind of goes up to about 10 out of 10 when it feels like it. So it's lots of fun,

Carl (03:04)
Wow. So, the hammer toe situation, is that a common theme and do they know how it happens or is it something that can be have prevented and you're just unlucky in that situation that it escalated to where it is or is this quite a common situation for veterans that people aren't aware of as well?

Lexi (03:21)
No, it's common for everybody actually. So it seems to be more prevalent in women, but it's something that you're born with and basically your toes are sort of misshapen. So instead of your toes bending forwards, they bend back on themselves and they're quite often they arch upwards. So your tendons are quite short in your feet. So when you run and things, you're kind of clawing at your shoes and it causes loads of pain. So you have to have surgery to correct it. So you basically have your joints removed, your tendons released.

Carl (03:23)
Well, okay.

Right, okay.

Right.

Lexi (03:50)
It's kind of lovely. And your joints released as well. So it's quite a big surgery. But normally it's corrective and you can get on and carry on as normal. Some people only have it in one toe. Other people have it in all of them. I had it in all of my toes apart from my big toe on both feet. So just unlucky, I guess.

Carl (03:56)
Wow.

So obviously, as you said, you had to elect to have your leg amputated. You've only had the one amputated, correct? Yeah. That must've been one hell of a decision to make. What sort of got to the point that...

Lexi (04:18)
Yeah, yeah, just the one.

Carl (04:28)
that one leg, did you like the other leg more than the other one or was it just a case of that one was causing the most issue, that one had to go? That must have been one hell of a decision to go through.

Lexi (04:32)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, pretty much. was just the left one was the one that had all the surgeries on. Surgeries didn't really work at all. They just caused more pain. I was on crutches and then I couldn't do anything at all. And I used to do sort of like quite a lot of sport. I'd do like climbing, pretty much anything that was sporty I'd want to do, running, cycling, swimming, anything. And I couldn't do any of it. So it was a case of I need a bit of life back. So yeah, I just...

Carl (05:06)
Hmm.

Lexi (05:08)
I literally said to my other half, look, if the next surgery doesn't work, which was taking another toe off. And I said that that's enough. I just want, I the leg off. I was in like so much pain at that point. It was an easy decision to be honest. And I thought if the leg comes off and I'm prosthetic, I can run and I can do everything else as normal. And yeah, that was it.

Carl (05:18)
Mmm.

Wow.

So that was below the knee, yeah. So with the prosthetic, how long did that take for that to be fitted and adapted? Because again, you've probably had to, the passion that you've obviously outlined for sport is quite critical. Did you have to relearn how to do all of that again? Have you fully adapted and fully got yourself back into it or is that kind of where you are now?

Lexi (05:41)
Yeah.

Yes. So I had my leg off four years ago. And so you don't get a prosthetic straight away. It takes about eight weeks and then you have to heal quite a bit. So I got a prosthetic to start with and you sort of learn how to walk with it. And I adapted quite well. I was walking sort of relatively normally and I was walking for quite a distance as well. But about two weeks after the surgery, I started to get a familiar pain.

Carl (05:54)
Mm.

Right.

Yeah.

Mm.

Lexi (06:21)
And I realized that the complex regional pain syndrome would come back in my stump. And then I got more pain on top of that and I started to get stabbing pains as well. And we realized I had neuromas in my stump, which is a nerve issue. So I couldn't wear the prosthetic anymore, which is why I'm completely wheelchair dependent now. So as a case of it, it was worth a shot. It was worth giving the amputation a go to get rid of the condition. Sometimes it comes back again, just a bit unlucky again. weird common thing there. Yeah.

Carl (06:25)
Wow.

Yeah.

It does seem to be the way. So as you said, you've got a real passion for sport. Has that always been through when you were a child and stuff? Did you play rugby as a kid and stuff like that? It wasn't around as much as a kid. Did you get much exposure in the, you said you in the army, correct? Did you get much exposure?

Lexi (07:08)
Yeah. Yeah. So we played a lot of football in the army, but no rugby at all. And when I was in, which was gutting, and when I was a kid, it just wasn't around at all. Even when I went to school, we never played any, any group sports at all, any team sports. And we got all the kit, but we never actually did it, which was, yeah, it's been an absolute nightmare. And we spent most of our time doing things like tennis and, you know, long distance running and stuff like that. was, yeah, one of those, one of those schools that didn't offer a great deal.

Carl (07:13)
Okay. Right, okay. Yeah.

No.

Lexi (07:37)
And so I didn't actually find rugby until literally just after I had my leg amputated. And so I watched, I watched the guys play rugby. I thought it was awesome. And then I went along to watch one of the roses games at Sandy Park and they played Italy. And I you know, we can't miss out on this opportunity. Let's let go long. And we, I just literally sat there and I was like, wow, this is absolutely phenomenal. I couldn't believe how tough.

Carl (07:42)
well.

Mm

Yeah

Yep.

you

Lexi (08:06)
our girls were and they're just completely bonkers. They're just like running like freight trains in front of each other and it's just like, wow, this is awesome. And then found out that they had a local team, Exeter Chiefs women, and went along to that game and never, well, I actually only missed one game since then. yeah, so it's, and we travel all over the country, sort of making sure the girls have got a sort of a bit of support. And we go to as many England games as we can. And yeah.

Carl (08:07)
they're

Yeah.

Yeah.

Really? Wow.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Lexi (08:35)
completely changed our lives to be honest. we do a lot of sport, do lot of triathlons, things like that. And since then it was like, where has this been all my life? I definitely would have done it if I had a chance to do it now, I'd 100 % be playing. offered a place to play wheelchair rugby.

Carl (08:37)
Wow.

I was going to say that, has that been a door open for you? Is that something you're going to take part in?

Lexi (09:02)
I'd like to give it a go, yeah. So I've got a few, so I've got this challenge and I've got a few others planned as well. So once I've done those, then yeah, I'd definitely give it a go because yeah, it's incredible.

Carl (09:15)
Is that a local team to you down there? there a bit of an untapped... Because obviously wheelchair sports in the Paralympics and stuff grows a lot of popularity through that period. There's a lot of those sort of games, basketball, etc. So is there a bit of an unknown league of wheelchair rugby that you've obviously had the door open you're going to potentially tap into? Is that something that's actually out there that we're not aware of?

Lexi (09:41)
Yeah, so there doesn't seem to be that many teams out there. And so the team that I got contacted by is West Country Hawks and they seem to be absolutely amazing. which is awesome. And I know that quite a of them are actually going to the Paralympics now. So, it's brilliant. Unfortunately, I think they're probably one of the only teams that are disabled.

Carl (09:44)
Okay.

Mm

Yeah.

well.

Bye.

Lexi (10:06)
a lot of people don't, in the teams that they can't get the full quota of disability or disabled athletes there. So they ended up recruiting able -bodied athletes to basically walk in, in a chair for the day and, and sort of join in. so yeah, I think it's still quite unknown. And I think a lot of people with disabilities don't realize that they can do it. So I think that it's a good thing to sort of spread the word about, you know, anyone getting a pro ball and, don't mind being bashed around a bit.

Carl (10:13)
Okay.

sit in a wheelchair and stuff.

Okay.

100 % yeah so we recently had yeah that's it. Well you've got the wheelchair to protect you to an extent so that would probably help a bit.

Lexi (10:38)
Yeah, yeah, I think it protects you and kind of hits you at the same time. Yeah, exactly.

Carl (10:44)
We'll try and make the positives. Yeah, we had the similar thing. We had the England women's deaf captain come on there a few episodes ago, Michelle Holdsworth. So she'd come on and we've been really promoting the deaf game within England. They've just gone to South Africa for a summer tour as well. And the men's won every game. They won the tour, the series tour. The women's didn't quite pull off that result because the South African team was...

Lexi (10:55)
Yeah.

and in.

Carl (11:14)
basically a fully -fledged professional team, Nyon out there. they've actually, but they've come away with some really good stories and hopefully getting Michelle back on in the near future to promote some other bits about the deaf game as well. I'll be definitely researching into the wheelchair stuff as well. Hopefully start spreading the word on that because as long as everyone can be included in this game, the game will never end. It's when we don't.

know about those little gems and people actually taking the time. Even the able -bodied people going and spending that day being strapped into a chair and having to adapt because that must be quite difficult because they're probably spotting a gap in their head that they know they'd potentially get on their legs but they're trying to have to judge it while learning how to use a wheelchair as well which that must be quite an impressive challenge for both sides as well to try and understand that. So that's definitely...

Lexi (12:08)
Yeah, yeah, definitely.

Carl (12:10)
here comes a cat. The cat's joined us behind. Yeah, no, that's brilliant. obviously the wheelchair you've got is not a sort of a racing or sports wheelchair, it? It's got a small adaption at the front. Is that so you don't fall over on hills and stuff? Is that kind of where that one is? Is that for the challenges and around the track and stuff?

Lexi (12:11)
Yeah, of course. He likes to do that.

Yeah, pretty much.

Yeah, so it's just a box standard wheelchair. So one that you'd use for shopping, essentially. And the wheel on the front, it's called a track wheel and it literally just stops you. So if you're going downhill, if you were to hit a stone or something, if you're going at speed, which I normally do, you'll get launched out of your chair. So, and if you hit curbs and things like that, again, you can get sort of launched out of your chair. So it's more of a safety device than anything. But yeah, I find it massively beneficial.

Carl (12:38)
Okay. well.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (13:04)
So without it, I'm absolutely useless at wheelchair skills. I have none at all. So my other half has better in my chair than I am. I'm absolutely rubbish. So yeah, it's really, really cool. It makes things a little bit tougher because it adds a bit weight to it. But yeah, I don't think I could do it without it really. I'd end up with breaking something probably.

Carl (13:11)
Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

It's not one of those sort of shopping trolley wheels that just go in any direction. It doesn't just scoot you off and put you in a different... Yeah. So how long did that take you to adapt to a wheelchair? Was it fairly instant or was that, that takes some time as well? Cause obviously...

Lexi (13:31)
No, I'm not going round and round in circles, probably. that. Never get anywhere.

Carl (13:48)
You said four years ago, you've pretty much just cracked on, done all these challenges, or was you basically use these challenges to train yourself how to use the wheelchair? Is that kind of where you've went and just thought, sorry, I'm going to go all in?

Lexi (13:53)
Yeah.

Yeah, basically, I kind of I came out of hospital, I was in my first wheelchair that I had, and which was a ridiculously heavy thing. And it was awful. It's when you you literally get sent home from hospital with a chair that's impossible to move almost. And that was the first day that I turned around to my other half and I said, I wonder if I can wheel this from John O 'Groats to Land's End. And the reaction was just like, no, here we go. Because my other half knows that if I get something in my head, doesn't go.

Carl (14:24)
Hey.

Lexi (14:27)
And yeah, so I spent the last, I sort of tried to do it then I was wheeling, started off doing like a kilometer, I think I managed and then built up to two and three and four. you know, just building up like you would do with running or anything else. It's just, body adapts over time. So learning how to use the chair and sort of using it as a sporting kind of tool at the same time. And then, yeah, just, just carried on and it was about probably eight months. It took me to get a chair that was actually

Carl (14:38)
Yeah.

Mmm.

Lexi (14:55)
usable. So it's a normal wheelchair again, just a normal everyday wheelchair. But it took me quite a while to get one of those. And once I did, I entered into my first lot of challenges, which was three years ago, which was I entered into the London Marathon and ended up doing two triathlons, four half marathons and the London Marathon. So that was the first lot of challenges and then went on from there. massive, massive load of support from the Chiefs girls.

Carl (14:58)
Yeah.

Lexi (15:22)
on my challenges all the way through. And then last year I did 12 hours around a track non -stop. And again, all the girls came. It was a bit like being at a rugby game actually, because we had the drum going and everyone was cheering and stuff at the end. It was awesome. It was really cool. So I got to sort of feel for a minute what the girls must feel like when we're sort of cheering at the side of the pitch. They were doing it back to me, which is really surreal. It was really odd.

Carl (15:24)
Yeah.

Yeah. Wow.

That's amazing.

Yeah.

I can imagine, yeah. So the four challenges that you've actually got world records on, what were they for the people that aren't aware of?

Lexi (15:54)
And so the first one was the half marathon and then it was the marathon. And then it was the furthest distance covered in 12 hours. All again, using a non -sport wheelchair, so everyday wheelchair. And then the fourth one was I found out somebody had beat my record for the half marathon. So I and did it again. And I always said that they don't mean that much to me and they don't to be honest, but it was a lovely lady from Australia who messaged me actually. And she said that I'd inspired her to

Carl (16:10)
Take care.

Lexi (16:22)
to do stuff in a wheelchair, which was incredible to hear. And that's one of things that I'm trying to do is sort of inspire people to get into sport when they, know, using whatever they can just to do something. And yeah, she said that she had managed to get my record and I was like, that's amazing. And I was really chuffed. And then I was like, yeah, I kind of need that back. So I kind of went and got it back again. So yeah, that's the four in a minute.

Carl (16:23)
wow.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Wow, so as you said, the world records don't mean as much in that sense. They do, but they don't. What's your favourite challenge you've ever done then? What's the one that really sticks in out of all of them that you think you've made the biggest impact from, but you also enjoyed the most?

Lexi (16:55)
Yeah.

I think probably the last one, so the 12 hours. I think it was the toughest definitely so far. wheeling for 12 hours on a track is a bit like wheeling on sand. So your chair, there's no freewheel at all. You just have to keep pushing and it's literally like going up uphill all the time. It's really super tough. So I had to build up over a year to do that one and I built up to 10 hours on the track and then did the 12 hours. I ended up having a heat stroke.

Carl (17:10)
Yeah.

Wow, yeah.

Lexi (17:33)
half way through, which was awful. spent, no, I really don't. It was so tough. ended up getting tendonitis in both wrists and both my arms. That was hilarious. But it was such a nice atmosphere. It didn't matter because everybody being there, it was just really lovely and it was such a nice day. I got to help lots of people. So yeah, that was definitely the best one.

Carl (17:36)
You've got no luck in anything health related.

Yeah.

That's amazing. So what training have you done for the current challenge? What have you had to do or have you just thought, I've got enough in the bank here just to get this done each day?

Lexi (18:10)
Yeah, I'm lucky. From the last challenge, I ended up having a coach. So she's a pro rugby player called Charlie Willett. She plays for the Trailfinders and she coaches me. she lives in London, so we do like remote coaching. So she's written on my programs, which is really, really amazing. So I've basically been doing like three marathons a week for the past six months. Going up there, I did a test week of five marathons to see how

Carl (18:21)
well.

Yeah.

Lexi (18:38)
my body would react and you know, whether it'd be all right or not. And it was, it was fine. Yeah. I woke up on the sixth day and I was like, I'm kind of gusseted. I don't have to do another one. So it was really good. I'm hoping that that'll carry on when I start the challenge because I'll be doing them every day. So it was literally 35 marathons in 35 days. So I'm hoping that that'll, yeah, it'll be the case again. But yeah, it sounds like a lot, but you kind of, you build up to it and it's just like anything you get used to it and.

Carl (18:58)
Wow.

Yeah.

Lexi (19:05)
Yeah, every time that they're tough at the end of a marathon is always tough, but you just kind of, you know, forget about it, eat something, move on to the next day and do it like that.

Carl (19:12)
Yeah. So have you got hotels booked or is it a case you've just got a of a camper van that's following along with all the supplies and stuff like that and you're just going to be able to rest as and because you've got a schedule you shared with me, you said some of the venues have changed and stuff. So we'll go through that in a minute. But you've got you targeting sort of 35, 40 kilometers a day. Is that roughly where it was at or is it a little bit more?

Lexi (19:30)
Yeah.

Yeah, it's, yeah, a bit more. So it's about 42 to, I think 48, the biggest, 42 is a full marathon. So I'll be doing a marathon or a little bit over every day. So yeah, this is kind of quite a hefty amount every day. But yes, we're staying in accommodation. We've managed to have a few sort of nights here and there that the hotels have given us for free, which is really, really kind of them.

Carl (19:46)
Yeah.

Yeah.

wow. Yeah.

Lexi (20:07)
Yeah, we've had to fork out for quite a lot because there's four of us in the support crew. So it's going to be me wheeling. And unfortunately, I would have done it a camper van wise, but because of medical conditions, I couldn't do it that way. I wish I could because I've got fibramyalga as well, which is another pain condition. I ended up with three of them. But yeah, because of that, I needed to make sure that I my own facilities and stuff like that. So yeah, it's just one of those things. Plus my two support crew.

Carl (20:10)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. Okay, yeah. Wow.

Yeah.

Lexi (20:35)
So we've got two that are there permanently. They're awesome. And then we're also like part of rugby family that all like, we our rugby family. We all go to like all the Chiefs games together and we travel around the country together and they've just been there the whole way. And so we've got Neil who's there all the way through and we've got a lovely lady called Pam, Purple Pam we call her, who's really cool. And then we've got like a rolling third person in the crew. So my other half in the first two weeks and then we've got people coming up.

Carl (20:41)
Yeah, yeah.

wow.

Brilliant.

Yeah.

Lexi (21:03)
up to different parts of the country for a week and sort of sharing the job really, which is going to be awesome. So it was nice to let them have a bit of comfort as well. So they're not sort of working together in a van. Bless them.

Carl (21:07)
wow.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

So basically if you don't make it to each hotel, everyone's sleeping on the side of the road at the minute, you've got, no pressure on you. You've got to get through it.

Lexi (21:23)
Yeah, pretty much. No, not at all. No. Yeah. As Neil said the other day, it's fine. We can all cramp in the van together and he'll do a barbecue in the back of the van. So we've got like a sport van, which has kind of been donated to us as well. And then we've got a sport car as well. So we've got a car following us in the van with all the kit and everything in it. So it takes quite a lot of kit to do something like this.

Carl (21:33)
Mmm.

Yeah. wow.

Okay.

So, yeah, I can imagine. the journey that you've got planned and the stops, are you sort of going by road or are you going to buy sort of the B road option rather than obviously not wheeling down the motorway obviously, I hope, as close as possible. So you've obviously had to probably plan this quite in depth to make sure that you can get along the road as.

Lexi (22:06)
Yeah, that could be interesting.

Carl (22:16)
Has anyone driven the route or have you just sort Google mapped it and thought, yeah, that might work? Is that pretty much where it's gone? Perfect.

Lexi (22:23)
Yep, Google map. Yeah, My other half bless her she's been painstakingly sat there in front of a computer for days on end. So we had a lady that did the whole route and then we Google mapped it to make sure it was okay. So we ended up having to make a few changes along the way. It ended up that I think I was on like a dual carriageway at one point, which wouldn't be ideal. And then there was a few paths that the vehicles couldn't make it down. So we had to change a few bits.

Carl (22:31)
Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

Lexi (22:49)
The kilometers started off at think about 1300 and we've ended up at 1500, 1508 kilometers is the total. So it's like 947, I think, So just under a thousand miles. Not too bad.

Carl (22:57)
Wow.

Amazing. Yeah, well, something to keep you busy, isn't it? So for those that are listening, where's the stops that you've got planned along the journey for people that can hopefully get out and see you and sort of cheer you on as you arrive? Because the plan is to carry a take a rugby ball down to each club, is that correct? And sort of share and connect the game.

Lexi (23:07)
Yeah, definitely.

That's it, yeah.

Carl (23:31)
So there's obviously going to be ones along the journey. So I think there'll be probably people hopefully listening to the pod that can get out and come and see you on the days that you turn up to their local club or as close as possible. So if we can go through the list, that'd be awesome.

Lexi (23:32)
Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, that'd be amazing. I mean, anybody's welcome to come along as well. The more people that come, the better, I think. So the first one is in Scotland, obviously. It's called Ross Sutherland Club. And then we've got Lockaber We're then going to Glasgow Warriors. We're then at Helensburugh. Further from that, we go to, let me have a look at my list, Carlisle Cougars. We're then at Garstang Rugby Club. then going to Wigan Warriors.

and Sale sharks, which have all been amazing. We're then at Luctonians We're still chatting to Gloucester and Bristol, but we're quite confident that they'll, fingers crossed, come on board. And then going into Bath and Chepstow from there. So we're coming through Chiefs, but they didn't actually, they're both having away games on the days that I'm coming through. So we're actually going to go back to them at the end.

Carl (24:15)
Yeah. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah.

Lexi (24:42)
We then go to Bude Rugby Club and then we're ending up in Truro and Truro Rugby Club are doing this amazing sort of finish event for us, which is incredible. And then on the 13th, so I finished on the 10th of October, on the 13th of October, we're sort of doing like finishing it off basically by giving the last ball back to Chiefs. So we're taking the first ball from Chiefs and we're giving it back to them on the 13th of October.

Carl (24:44)
well.

Yeah.

wow.

Lexi (25:08)
when everybody will be there. So it's going to be kind of amazing.

Carl (25:10)
Yes.

So the 13th of October is, is that a home game for the Chiefs as well? So they've got a big event. Wow. So.

Lexi (25:16)
Yeah, it be. Yeah. Yeah. So it's going to be as far as I know it's the Chiefs women are playing Leicester Tigers, which is going to be great because Leicester is somewhere that I really wanted to go to, but it was it was really off the sort of path. It meant sort of driving for about two hours and bless them. The support crew are going to be driving really slow following after me like for sort of four and a half hours a day and telling them they got to drive for an extra two hours that I don't think they would have been too keen on that.

Carl (25:27)
Yeah.

It's quite a detour, yeah.

Nice.

Lexi (25:45)
But so it's going to be nice to actually see them as well. So they get to be get to be part of it because each club gets to gets to keep the ball. So the ball is going to be signed by the previous team passed on to team and the next team and the next team. So they all get to get to keep a ball, which is again, they've all been donated by MTRI and the Rugby Institute. So it is amazing. So we've got like an official ball. It's going to be put on the support and on the first support car. And that's going to be the focus of the event, which is just amazing.

Carl (25:53)
Yeah.

wow. Yeah. Brilliant.

Yeah. Well, obviously we'll get the schedule off yourself and I'll share it on our socials. Might be able to tag the Tigers in. They might do the two hour drive for you. They might come and meet you on the way down, save your support team, you never know. as we know, the rugby family does a lot. So you never know, they might be able to turn up.

Lexi (26:19)
William.

Yeah.

That's a good one.

Yeah. Yeah. Thanks to them that I've been able to put this together, basically. The teams have been amazing, so helpful. Like literally, we just mentioned it to them and most of them have just been like, yeah, you know, come on down, we'll do this, we'll do that, we'll sort everything out. All the people that are doing the event, I've got like 10 people working away in the background and they're all like part of the Rugby family that have all sort of put everything together.

Carl (26:38)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. Brilliant.

Lexi (27:00)
And it's just been, the response has been phenomenal. And I just, I hope when I get to the finish line, if I can sort of encourage 20, 30, 40, 50 more people to come along and watch the games, then I'll be ecstatic. So I'm going to be putting out daily posts as well. And it's, I'm going to be wearing a different pair of shorts for one of the chiefs women. And we've got a lot of sort of players from all over the world. And it's sort of telling people about who they are.

Carl (27:11)
Mmm. Yeah.

Wow.

Okay.

Mm

Mm -hmm.

Lexi (27:29)
but also telling people about what position they play in. So it's in very simple terms. When I was first learning everything about rugby that I could, it took me a while to get to grips with it with everything. So I thought if I put things in very simple terms of this position does this, and then people that don't know the positions in rugby can hopefully learn something as well. And introducing some awesome players to people as well. So hopefully that'll be fun.

Carl (27:32)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, 100%. There's definitely, there's a lot of people that aren't exposed enough to the game and these brilliant challenges that a lot of yourself embark on and people try to spread the word. There was the whole reason why I started the pod as well was the case of a lot of people who understand the Six Nations and the World Cup, but the bits that actually make the game tick and what everyone still turns up for, the grassroots game and the women's games growing exponentially in the UK, which is amazing.

Lexi (28:00)
Yeah.

Carl (28:23)
It's still not got the exposure on the telly as much. there's a great pickup coming from, so Haven't Women's is a local club to where I used to live in Portsmouth. So they're just up the road. They had, I think the other day they had over 50 women turn up to their training on a Tuesday night, which is really, really good to see. That's a brilliant, brilliant turnout. And I think they've got two, maybe three teams effect nearly on the women's level as well. So, and they've got a good,

Lexi (28:41)
Wow. That's amazing. Yeah.

That's what I'm after.

Carl (28:53)
a new system as well which is really really doing well so it's a game in the up and we've got to carry on promoting it as much as possible because to be honest sometimes the women do better than the men in the internationals so we've got to cover our bets somehow.

Lexi (28:57)
Brilliant.

Yeah.

Yeah, definitely.

Yeah.

Yeah, they've done too badly in the Six Nations and that thing.

Carl (29:14)
No, exactly, yeah, definitely. as a rugby fan, how important do you believe that obviously connecting grassroots and the pro game is to allow people to fall in love with the game and feel like they can become something with the game? Obviously within the women's game, I think that the disjoint is not quite as bad as for the men's game, I think, because obviously the women's have only just

been able to sort of push themselves forward. Is that a fear that you think that the women's game might become a little bit more disjointed because there isn't the leagues under the PWR that has got that continuity to close the gap and that the women's Premier League becomes an isolated piece similar to what the men's Premiership has? I know they've obviously just approved promotion and relegation, but the last thing we want is that to happen in the women's game, do you think?

Lexi (30:08)
Yeah.

Carl (30:10)
Closing the gap on the grassroots with these challenges, the more involvement that the women have with the grassroots will allow that to not happen in our sport in the UK.

Lexi (30:19)
I hope so. I think there's a lot of unknowns about what's going to happen at the moment. I think with the women, because things are sort of moving up or they've moved up slowly, I think that everything's going to sort of stay more connected, if you know what mean. So there's going to be more of a connection between the grassroots and sort of

Carl (30:32)
Hmm.

Mm.

Lexi (30:43)
leading on to the pro levels. just watching the Chiefs go from playing in the grassroots level and then the players moving up to being Chiefs and moving through the academies. Most of the male teams have academies, they go in the grassroots clubs, they move to an academy and then they go on to being a pro player. So, a lot of the women's teams didn't have that.

Carl (30:55)
Hmm.

Yeah.

Hmm.

Lexi (31:11)
And I think some of them are starting to have that now so that you've got that continuity. And I think if people can watch their, you know, it's sort of like their brothers, their sisters, their friends play and then move them up as they move on through their career, then that's going to be an amazing thing because as soon as you watch somebody and they're progressing well, that comes with an audience and that comes with a few people that are watching that person that other people will talk about and then.

Carl (31:29)
Hmm.

Lexi (31:38)
It carries on and the audience grows. And I think that's an amazing thing.

Carl (31:41)
Yeah. So obviously, as you said, you've gone to a few England games. you see that the price is increasing because of the popularity? Do you think there's a little bit more of a tax because they've done better to a certain extent and that's closing out a certain level of fan? Because the women's game is more inclusive, 100%. There's more families go to it. Everyone that wants to go and watch that game.

Lexi (32:02)
Yeah.

Carl (32:09)
is there because they love the game, they love what it represents, it allows families to go and watch a sport that they can feel part of. The men's game is similar but not, it's a little bit more disjointed, it's a lot more expensive, it's already the ship's sail potentially. The last thing we want to do is that with the women's game because the women's international bit is the big piece for a lot of fans to get together from across the UK and England.

Lexi (32:20)
Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah.

Carl (32:39)
to allow them to see their roses, correct? Whereas the PWR doesn't seem to have that level of attendance at the minute by making the international game too expensive. Is that gonna increase the attendance of the PWR? I'm unsure, to be honest, in my opinion. I don't think they're gonna revert back to the club game instead of going to see the roses. Do you know what I mean?

Lexi (32:44)
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

No.

No, think because all the roses play for the clubs themselves. you've got a lot of roses that are, we've got quite a in Chiefs now, you've got quite a few in Gloucester and Bristol. So the roses are scattered about in the normal clubs that you go to. And I think people that are fans of the roses themselves, quite often you'll find that they'll go to the local games because they see their roses there.

Carl (33:16)
Yeah.

Yep.

Lexi (33:37)
and then they see other players and then they get to know the other players and they get to love the team and that's what the beauty of what the roses can give and does give to the game. So I think people that love rugby will go to both. The prices have gone up a little bit, but not to such a level that, I mean, just through speaking to other people, it's not at that level where people would say, right, I'm not gonna go and watch a sport now and I'm not gonna have that day out because

Carl (33:44)
Mm.

Lexi (34:04)
you actually look at the cost of it. like if you go to Twickenham it's like 15 pounds, I think it is now. You can't even really go to your local cinema to watch a movie for that. you're getting four hours of entertainment because most people go a bit before and they'll go and have some food or walk around and then they'll watch the game and then they'll stay a little bit afterwards and see the team. And so you've got like almost a whole day out there for 15 pounds per person. that's still not that much really when it comes to what enjoyment

Carl (34:13)
No.

Yeah.

No.

Lexi (34:34)
what experience you can have and what that can bring to people as well. for me, it's not just watching rugby and loving the game, but it's the whole atmosphere, which is second to none. I've never actually felt anything like that. I've been to concerts and other things, but the rugby atmosphere is just incredible. And you get a stadium like Twickenham that's full. Even at some of the local games, I think we had 6 ,000 last year at Sandy Park.

Carl (34:44)
Hmm.

Hmm.

Lexi (35:04)
And everyone was making such noise. was, it felt like a full you know, a full sort of, you know, 10, 10, 10 ,000 plus sort of stadium. was incredible. And it's that, that sort of atmosphere that I think people will, you know, if they come along, they tend to love it and not worry about when it comes to, I think if the price sort of quadruples, then it might become a worry. But you see that.

Carl (35:05)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, well I think they've got, I think they're saying 30, 40 quid for the sort of the Women's World Cup is gonna be the sort of entry level ticket. And then by the time you get to, obviously get to Twickenham, because obviously if you drive up, it's gonna be what, three, four hours for you to get to sort of Twickers, probably a hundred odd quid in fuel. If you get the train, you're at pretty much the cost of a three bed semi somewhere, to be honest.

train prices are obscene. So it's not just the price of the ticket, it's the accessibility across as well for a lot of families. By the time you paid four tickets at 30, 40 quid, it soon adds up, it? And I think that's potentially we're going to lose the price point. I think, as you said, it's actively now to make sure people attend.

Lexi (35:51)
Yeah, yeah. They're a bit ridiculous.

a lot.

Yeah, it does.

Carl (36:19)
I just hope they don't lose the sight of that, especially with the Allianz agreement, because obviously we're not allowed to call it Twickenham now, are we?

Lexi (36:27)
yeah, forgot about that. It's so hard not to, it's really hard not to not to call it, but yeah, yeah.

Carl (36:30)
What? What?

What a calamity. They've really missed the bar with that one. Like, 100 % bringing the game, bring money into the game and find ways of it getting to the grassroots, but you can't rename home, can you? It's...

Lexi (36:40)
Yeah, I think so.

No, no, exactly. Yeah, it's like changing Buckingham Palace to be in, you I don't know. Yeah, it just doesn't work, it? I don't think anybody will sort of honour that particularly, other than when they have to, of course, but it's really hard to even think of it. yeah, think if it's brought money into the game that it needs, then great, but

Carl (36:57)
sponsored by TikTok or something like that.

We've got to see where it comes.

Lexi (37:19)
Yeah, don't change the name. Have the sponsor in the background, you know, have it everywhere. That's fine, but don't change the name. It's just mad.

Carl (37:26)
To be fair to World Rugby, they turned around and told them they can't rename it during the World Cup. So the Women's World Cup, it will have to remain Twickenham. So they can't rename it. So fair play to World Rugby. They've actually, they've got something correct for once. Cause they usually miss the bar and a lot of things as well with them. So they've enforced it to stay Twickenham, which is, yeah, it's a crazy thing. are you, cause England have got New Zealand in November.

Lexi (37:36)
Yeah, right.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Carl (37:56)
September and it's you're probably gonna miss that you'll be on your challenge Wow

Lexi (37:58)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, I'm going to miss and I think there's two games I'm going to miss. So which I'm massively gutted about. Really, really gutted. We actually looked at sort of where we were and saw if it was feasible that we could go over, like go and watch the game and then come back. And it was just like, yes, it's just not possible. But yeah, I suppose a small sacrifice to hopefully help the women's game a little bit. So hopefully that works.

Carl (38:05)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, hopefully they can obviously get you on the big screen and stuff as well and share the journey because obviously that would be a really good thing to see from the RFU just to try and support something that's trying to grow the grassroots game. So we'll get tagging, start tagging them in this stuff, see if we can get them involved because it's an amazing challenge and there's not enough done for the grassroots game to spread that connectivity as well, I think.

Lexi (38:41)
Yeah.

Yeah, which would be amazing. Yeah.

Carl (38:56)
There's a lot of fans that are at a point that they can't continue doing everything because now obviously they've put the price up for, well obviously the Champions Cup's now only available on Premier Sport, so you've got four or five different subscriptions and for a typical rugby fan, you're looking at 90 odd quid a month just to be able to watch the games.

Lexi (39:19)
Yeah. Yeah. It's just, it's just mad. It was a bit like it last year with having to have TNT and things like that. And you've got like rugby pass and stuff, which is great, a lot that is quite often to acts difficult to access the games on some of the platforms as well. So you'll be sort of playing catch up and trying to like patch in and it goes dead and in the of a game and which is really frustrating. So yeah, that doesn't help with things. I always think, you know, that they had this problem with

Carl (39:22)
Mm. Yeah.

Lexi (39:48)
with women's football. So, you know, it took people to realise that actually it's got potential. So they put a load of money in it and took a chance on it. And I think doing that with women's rugby would pay off as well. And obviously it's easy for me to say, I don't know what the books look like and all the stuff in the background. But I think from talking to so many other people that are big fans of the game and of women's rugby, that they would, you know, they all seem to think the same thing and they'll think, well, you know, just, just take a chance on it and see what happens because

Carl (40:02)
you

Hmm.

Lexi (40:18)
We've so I can say that bad word again. First time I went in there, it wasn't completely packed. I've watched it, I've gone in there and think, what was it, 40 ,000 when they had the Six Nations final last year. And that was just amazing to see. And I think it's got the potential of filling the whole stadium quite easily. And in other stadiums around the country as well, it's got that potential. When I first started going to Chiefs,

Carl (40:26)
it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (40:47)
There was like 300 people there. And now regularly there's 2000 or more. And that's on days where it's cold and miserable. So you can get a lot more than that. But I think there's still potential to be more than that. And there's a lot of people that don't know about it and they have sort of differing opinion. So they'll go and watch the guys play, which is amazing. And they definitely should. But they think that the girls game is going to be Nancy Pancy and...

Carl (40:53)
Ehh

Yeah.

Lexi (41:13)
that kind of thing and they couldn't be more wrong. So it's yeah, these girls are honestly, I've never seen anything like it. I don't know how they're that tough. They're just incredible. So I think that's something that blew me away completely. It's like how they still walk in.

Carl (41:13)
Far from it. Yeah.

In your opinion, how do we give the game that exposure? How do you think, apart from pumping the money, because we've got to somebody that's got to the money in, and I think that would have to be a global agreement as well to grow the women's game. I think you'd have to find somebody that's going to every league, women's league across the world to make that viable. I don't think just putting money into the of the PWR will...

be able to suffice grow in the game enough for a global piece. So I think that would have to be a global finance. But I think the women are doing an exceptional job of putting themselves out on social media. think it's like, is it Ilona Maher or something like that from America who's got about eight billion followers on Twitter or whatever it's stupid. Like there's an obscene amount and her.

Lexi (42:03)
Yeah, definitely.

Yeah, they are.

Yeah.

Yeah, she's like 3 .2 million on Instagram alone. So you look at the other platforms that she's on and yeah, she's doing amazing things for the sport and for the body positivity as well, which I think is a really good thing to do. So there's a lot of negativity around women's sport in general, but especially women's rugby. And I think she's doing amazing things to educate people and say that, you don't have to be a certain body type to be a professional athlete.

Carl (42:43)
Mm. Okay. Yeah.

Lexi (42:51)
That's what I think a lot of people forget. These, these girls are professional athletes, but the professional athletes that also have to work on top of being a professional athlete. So you imagine doing that, you know, the training and that, that they do that there's like six, eight hour sessions that they do. And then they're going to work in the morning just beforehand or going to work in the evening. And, know, it's just not, right. You know, it's just very bizarre that they'd even have to do that because in other sports, you don't have to do that. You can just be a professional athlete and.

Carl (42:54)
Yep.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (43:20)
Yes, it's really tough on them, they spend so much time doing social media and things like that. And they are doing an amazing job. I think that the local clubs can potentially do a little bit more and put more out there about the girls. think, know, World Rugby could do a bit more. And then, you know, I know they've got great plans for the World Cup and it sounds like it's going to be incredible. And the venues that they go into as well, they're great venues, all of them. And we're lucky that I think we've got

Carl (43:36)
Mm

Yeah.

Lexi (43:48)
got two games here in Exeter, so I'm really chuffed about that. yeah, I'll be interested to see what happens with it. think putting it, putting a lot more promotion out there on mainstream sort of platforms that people use. you know, maybe in the morning when people are more likely to watch TV at prime time sort of, you know, sort of TV spots and having just bits out there about it, having it on social media, repetitively, just saying to people that, you know, that this is how much it costs for this amazing day out.

Carl (43:50)
Yeah, it's brilliant.

Hmm.

Yeah.

Lexi (44:17)
you know, come along if you can, that sort of thing. And bring your kids along and, you know, watch your kids get inspired by these amazing girls. Yeah, I think just having it there and getting people talking about it is gonna help.

Carl (44:30)
think it's something that football does at the minute. So I'm a Poultsmouth fan, obviously used to live down here, grew up, season ticket holder, et cetera. There's a common thing that they do is kids for a quid. So a parent will bring, they'll be a full paying adult and they can bring as many kids along with them and that full paying price adult is a kid for a quid. So you could have four kids, they come for four quid.

and you've got to pay your full ticket. But usually on those games, they're subsidised. So worst case, it's 20, 30 quid max in for five of you to go to a game. Rugby doesn't seem to close the gap on certain kids' tickets, especially in the men's game, because the women's game, brilliant. think the price point is basically there. You're not going to go wrong with if it's five quid for a kid to every game. And the season ticket's probably what?

35 quid or something stupid like that is it's subsidized heavily enough to make it work. I think the men's game I think a section like that where you can make sure that you've got or even just say on the day actually we've got all these tickets unsold adults come you get a subsidized price but your kids come free just get just because it's they're going to lose money by the seat being empty

Lexi (45:49)
Yeah, think that's right, do.

Carl (45:55)
But by the time they've come there, the kids ended up talking to their parents in the bar, I'm a bottle of Coke, a packet of crisps, a burger, they've got made money on there and they might have then gained another fan that will come more often. I think we're very closed as a game to, because the financial dependencies are there so much, you can't subsidize things too much, but in turn, it would.

Lexi (46:09)
Yeah, definitely.

Carl (46:23)
save for clubs down the line. It's a very short -sighted response. think the women's game obviously as you said it's multiply two quid, five quid, whatever it is for a kid. That's easily accessible.

Lexi (46:33)
Yeah. Yeah.

Carl (46:36)
It's just the men's game doesn't seem to close the gap. And I might be completely wrong there, but it's not publicised enough if it does happen. And I think that's the biggest issue. No, and if it does, again, it's the women's games pretty much nailed the social media aspect. I think obviously the men's, the women's, women's game being so accessible on social media, that's all, of that's being pushed by the player himself, which I think...

Lexi (46:44)
Yeah, I haven't heard about it happening.

Carl (47:05)
a brilliant aspect within the women's game that they feel free enough to be able to do that because a lot of the men aren't able to because if they say the wrong thing, do the wrong thing, game over. They potentially lose their career. Whereas the women's game, obviously, I think there was the during the Olympics where one of the GB athletes made a  error on what ended up on social media.

Lexi (47:18)
Yeah, they're getting trouble. Yeah.

Carl (47:33)
The rest of them have pretty much got it nailed. The men's just doesn't sit there. There's no icon, there's no idol that you can see. Whereas the women's games got those sort of players. You've got the Maddie Levi coming in from Australia Sevens. You've got that Ilona Maher coming in and all of these amazing female athletes with massive outreach. But they're also not being...

Lexi (47:33)
Yeah.

Carl (48:00)
push to support, push the right things within the game. There's a lot of stuff to bring them followers, but there's not as much to say, I got started because this, this and this. It's not being, they've got an amazing platform. I think there could still be bits that they could do to bring more in because a lot of kids and lot of parents are only getting told the bad things about the game, that your head's gonna get knocked off, you're gonna be in a wheelchair because you've...

Lexi (48:16)
Yeah.

bring in.

Carl (48:29)
got concussion six times and you're not going to be able to know your own grandchildren and stuff like that. You get told all the bad things about the game because people are so risk averse within society in a minute. The one thing that could probably benefit more because I've played the game, obviously you fell in love with the game, you see the values, you see the rugby family, you gain people.

Lexi (48:32)
Yeah.

Yeah, no.

Carl (48:56)
within your family. Sometimes you don't even want them there, but they're there if you need them, aren't they? You could call them up and they're there. And that's the beauty of this game that doesn't get sold. And I think there's enough people now within the women's game that have got the platform, but are they getting to the point where they're too scared to push things or call things out? Ilona done an amazing thing the other day though, where she managed to secure basically four million pounds for the women's American.

Lexi (49:00)
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Yeah, they're

Yeah.

Carl (49:26)
because she put it out there and said, needs to be done. And that's exceptional.

Lexi (49:29)
Yeah, yeah, it was incredible. And, and actually said the way things are, which people don't know that they have no idea. know, a lot, an awful lot of people that I speak to literally have no idea that they think that the women are rich, know, that they get paid a fortune. And it's like, some of them don't actually even get paid at all. But they go into all these games that the international players, a lot of them have to pay for their own flights to play rugby for their country, and then pay for their flights home.

Carl (49:34)
Not. Not.

Lexi (49:58)
And they're working part -time to be able to do that. So they're basically working just to play rugby all the time. And they're playing for their country. Who else does that? Nobody does that. It's absolutely bonkers. I think, yeah, they could probably sort of say a few other bits about the game. it makes me wonder, knowing a few other girls and how passionate they are and how much they want the game to grow. It makes me wonder whether they're not able to say a few

Carl (50:07)
It's madness.

Lexi (50:27)
bits about the game possibly. Because I think if they could, they probably would. So yeah, it's that sort of grey area that only the privileged few know about.

Carl (50:29)
Yeah. Wood.

is the media training basically saying you can only do this and that's never going to allow the game to grow because rugby, football, basketball, all of those have got big idols because they've got people that people can put on a pedestal or hate. You've also got to the opposite, you've got to have the hero and you've got to have the anti -hero and there's not enough of either within the game of rugby. There's plenty of people that can play the character.

Lexi (50:44)
Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, exactly.

Carl (51:09)
and grow the game brilliantly in that sense but we seem that they're not allowed to and if they do go too far that's it they cancel the games over.

Lexi (51:22)
Yeah, yeah, which is definitely not what we want. mean, you know, seeing just a couple of the clubs closing last year, know, Wasps and Worcester Warriors, that was heartbreaking enough. what happens when, where did the players go when that happened? You know, it's really, really tough. it's that sort of finding that fine balance. So they need more people in the door, but they need to get more people in the door. So how do you do that? It's a really, really tough one. But I think, I think a lot more can be done.

Carl (51:39)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (51:52)
And a lot more awareness can be out there about the game and just talking to people about it and say, know, suppose, dispelling some of the myths about it. Like you said, you know, if you play this game, you're going to end up like this. Well, actually what is the percentage of people that end up like that? So it's only a low percentage of people that end up, you know, with multiple concussions that are going to end up with problems. There's so much help there now to stop that from happening. You know, the girls get a concussion, then they're off for a week or more.

Carl (52:00)
Yeah.

Lexi (52:20)
And that they're very, you know, sort of well looked after and people make sure they're okay. And injuries happen in any sport. And then the day this is a contact sport, it's going to happen. So, but, you know, it's showing that people, think the other side, if, yeah, you might get injured, but you get injured in everyday life and in other sports anyway. But this is the one place that you will find that camaraderie. And I liken it to when I was in the army and the camaraderie I had there, I thought that I'd never get anywhere else. And actually I've.

Carl (52:27)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (52:49)
found it again in the Rugby family, which is somewhere where I never thought that that would happen. But I have that literally the same sort of, yeah, you you can call someone up whenever you want and they will always be there for you. And that's exactly what Rugby gives you. I think that's, you know, if any sort of, you know, little youngster goes along and you tell the parents that that's what they're going to get, they're going to have friends for life, they're going to have a community where they'll fit in, then it's worth it every day of the week, isn't it? So.

Carl (52:49)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

100%. I don't think we do enough in schools as well. I think the schools don't close the gap enough. Like, as you said, if you found the game at school, you'd have been in love with it forever. You went to a school that obviously clearly didn't do much in sporting team supports, which is obviously quite critical for a lot of people. Not everyone's a lone bird. want to be part of a, effectively like a pack, don't they? They want to feel part of something that's going to make a difference.

Lexi (53:20)
Yeah.

it.

Carl (53:46)
you do make friends for life when you find the right team and you're right teammates. And I think the schools don't go far enough because they're too scared that somebody's gonna get hurt on their watch. And also the problem is the teachers aren't educated in all sports. They come in usually because they've done a teaching degree in PE or whatever it is these days, whatever they've got to do.

Lexi (53:52)
Yeah.

Yeah, exactly.

Carl (54:10)
They do enough to tick the exercises that they can complete and they're competent, which is brilliant, that's fine. But make them go and do, say, six weeks at a rugby club, six weeks at a swimming club, six weeks at a football club, as part of that degree to actually give these kids an opportunity because you can give them a rugby ball, run around, brilliant, that's fine. Nobody's killed each other today, right, that's it, you've completed rugby and that's it for the next three months.

If you had a teacher or somebody come in to say, actually, if you do this, this and this, you've got a real talent there. I think we miss that from grassroots, literally from the fledgling part that it's there. Local clubs do an amazing amount to get youth rugby and mini rugby and everything like that. it's usually because a parent or a friend of a parent plays the game.

Lexi (54:45)
Yeah, you never know.

Yeah, they do.

Yeah, yeah, quite often. quite often that they have, you know, in order to see it, you have to sort of go on and find a Facebook page or whatever page you would have to actually know about it. And the fact that it was going on for so long and, you know, me and my mother love so many different sports and we didn't know about it, that's saying something that wasn't that long ago, you know, that's shocking.

Carl (55:32)
Yeah.

Lexi (55:35)
people that we know that go to rugby with us on a regular basis, they all found the game a very similar way. They just took a chance on it one day and thought we'll pop along and watch a game. That's how they got completely and utterly devoted to the game. if we didn't see it and we watch a lot of sport on TV and elsewhere, how many other people are not getting exposed to it? Like you said, at school level, that's super important to get. If your kid's playing sport,

Carl (55:39)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (56:05)
then the parents are to get into it and so on and so on. It all contributes to getting more and more people to the game. But yeah, think schools can do a lot more. I worry about the fact that they are so, like you said, risk averse and they worry too much about kids getting injured. to me, when I was a kid, it was just part of growing up. You get hit, you fall out of trees, you do stuff, you you get knocked.

Carl (56:30)
I think I had my filing cabinet at the local hospital to be honest, amount of times I got injured as a kid. it's, again, I think it's not just down to schools. I think society in general has also changed. It's easier to put a kid in front of a PS5 or a Xbox and let them play that game. then that's the only, but the problem is there's not many rugby games on there. There's not many games because...

Lexi (56:34)
I'm

Yeah.

No, wait a minute.

Carl (56:57)
There is some games and they're brilliant if you understand the game. But when I grew up, you had John Lomu rugby. You had Brian Lara cricket on the PS1 and stuff. You had them. I didn't have a clue about rugby at that age, but I played it because I thought, it looks brilliant. And then other kids would come around, yeah, brilliant, let's just play that. But there was such a big gap, it just disappeared. then...

Lexi (57:08)
Yeah.

Carl (57:25)
They've now got rugby 24, 25, stuff like that. So they've got games out there. But again, unless you're a rugby fan, you're not going to buy it. You're not going to pay out ever much. I think when I actually looked at it, because I went to a game in Spain and they had it on behind one of the stands, they had two or three consoles for the kids to go out in between the two games. So they two international games on. So the kids were going out, playing rugby 24 or whatever it was at the time. And then going back in to watch the game after.

I don't think any of the players are actually called the players again, so it's like a pro -evo soccer version where they used to have like messy spelt backwards and stuff like that. was these crazy... So it's not even like they're being able to promote players and I think there's multiple ways on that.

Lexi (58:01)
Wow.

Yeah. no.

Yeah, if you have your favourite player, there's something there missing out on as well, isn't it? Because again, a double -edged sword. If your favourite player, you might play the game and then you get to know the player a bit more. It's like, yeah, that's shocking. It's terrible.

Carl (58:24)
But the game also doesn't help with that because we've got a fixed number system. Because we only use one to 15, that number could change every game. I think if you had squad numbers, that would allow a player to have an identity. I know they change, don't get me wrong, but if they have to have X amount registered, that is your squad numbers and that's the players that That allows the player to create a brand. Without that freedom, you're not gonna get.

Lexi (58:41)
Yeah.

Carl (58:54)
You can't go and get players. The only pretty much banker is a first team selection every week. You can pretty much guarantee they're going to be there. Marler's always going to play number one, or worst case he's got 17 on his back or whatever. unless you're following one of the... Look, the amount of youth players that coming through, their mate might have a son that idolises them. They can't go get their shirt number with his name on the back because there isn't one.

And I think that doesn't allow us to put, as I said earlier, put players on pedestals, whereas the women's game does, but not, you can't go and get a shirt on that. Well, you can, you can't, because most of the women's first 15s are pretty much there or thereabouts at the minute, because the players at top are development in that sense. I think that's fair to say. I think there's some pretty much guaranteed fair choices. So.

but that doesn't get pushed, that doesn't get put in the club shop. You can't go to the club shop and get Mo Hunt number nine on the back or, do you know what, all of these other players, you've got Lark Davies, you can't get her shirt number, you can't get Maher on your back or number seven or whatever. There's not that availability to be able to have a player create a brand, especially when they've got such a platform on social media, which...

Lexi (59:49)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, they have. I think when we went to our last England game, Marley Packer always walked around the stadium afterwards, worked with their little boy and the amount of people that were there wanting to just say hello and asking her to sign things, that says alone what a massive fan base that she has. And I think a lot of people would really, really want to have Packer on the back of their top wall.

Carl (1:00:24)
Yeah. Yeah.

There.

Lexi (1:00:45)
and the captain of the USA team, so Kate Zachary. So yeah, again, she's like, I think number 14, she plays that. yeah, impossible, even in America, you can't get a Kate Zachary top with a number on the back. So it's, I mean, you can get it done yourself. So there is that avenue out there. The Chief Shop in Exeter, if you buy a shirt, they will...

Carl (1:00:50)
Yeah.

Lexi (1:01:13)
the number on the back for you or you can get whatever you like on the back so that that sort of is there as an option. But yeah, if the numbers are changing all the time, it's quite tough, isn't it? But yeah.

Carl (1:01:13)
Okay. Yeah.

Yeah, I think because even you've got Emily Scarrett, obviously she's got her own podcast, got all of that, she's got a big fan base. She was injured for two years. So you don't know what number she's going to come back with. Like any typical rugby player, you start maybe start in the backs and you slowly get fatter and you slowly work your way through. So you could have it the season before they're playing centre, next thing you know they're playing number eight and then two years later they're further forward in the pro. And it's...

Lexi (1:01:29)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yes. Yeah.

Yeah.

Carl (1:01:52)
I don't know, I think there's not enough done to allow players to create an individual brand as well. David Beckham made a nail of it, didn't he? Number seven was his number. He rebranded it to 23, done an exceptional job. Cristiano Ronaldo, number seven, done it. Messi, number 10. You've got all of these players, Maradona, you've got all of these players throughout history in football that have been allowed to...

Lexi (1:02:02)
Yeah, yeah, it did.

Yeah. Yeah.

Carl (1:02:19)
create a brand around their name, their number and their name. We just don't allow it. thought Omar Otojo would be the perfect character for that. Cause obviously he signed for the rock nation under like Jay Z and all that. he created, he signed for a big brand deal, but you don't, you don't see much out of him in that sense, do you? You don't see him being and

Lexi (1:02:41)
No, nothing at all.

Carl (1:02:43)
Whether we're not seeing the right avenues, I don't know. Maybe it's something that put down to the algorithm that we don't all see. again, it's a shame that we can't have that one person to hang a cap on like a Michael Jordan or something like that to create that. Anton DuPont, perfect, brilliant. But he's not a very exciting character. Do you know what I mean? He's not done a tour lang, he's not jumped off a ferry in New Zealand. He hasn't done something, he's exceptional player, but he's not...

Lexi (1:02:51)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Carl (1:03:14)
It's not marketable in that sense, just because of raw talent. Brilliant, it's easy to market, but not... And you can see that in the social media figures as well from the women's game that it's exponential compared to where the top men's players are, compared to the women's game that's actually been able to market himself individually.

Lexi (1:03:17)
Yeah.

Yeah, mean, I think the roses have got quite a decent following, lot of the roses. Are they the newer ones? Not so much. mean, some of the girls that I follow that are newer roses, Maisie Allen she did amazingly. She came out in her first game and she scored a try in her first game, which is brilliant. And I think she scored a try in her second game as well. And she's done so well, so quickly as well. She's definitely sort of one to watch for the future, I think.

Carl (1:03:40)
Yeah. Yeah.

Lexi (1:04:06)
And, she's back in camp again, like this year, but her social media following is so small. But I know she's not sort of really into social media that much. She's more, she just loves the game and she plays it and she does an amazing job. I don't think she sort of worries about that side, but I know she does worry about the women's game just like everyone and wants it to get bigger. So they'll, you know, they'll actually be treated as professional athletes one day. So, yeah, it's difficult one.

Carl (1:04:08)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Hmm.

Lexi (1:04:37)
I think it's quite a lot to ask, asking somebody that's doing all that as well to have to do so many social media posts and things like that. I've only learnt it this year, how long it takes. It takes forever. It's like editing and learning where to put them and all that kind of thing. I'm still learning myself and still got long way to go. I think some people get it right and they're...

Carl (1:04:41)
Yep.

Mmm, nice. It's a whole full -time job on top of itself, isn't it? It's madness.

Lexi (1:05:05)
I think it must be a natural talent somewhere. My coach, Charlie Willett, she's got a huge following on TikTok. I don't even know what it is, but she's got a massive following. I know she's an influencer on there. And literally she's just showing her rehab from ACL injuries that she's had. Which helps other rugby players. I know you get ACL injuries in other sports, but it's quite a common one in rugby. So she helps a lot of people through that, which is really good.

Carl (1:05:14)
Yeah.

Yeah. wow, yeah.

Lexi (1:05:34)
they'd sort of find a brand within themselves then yeah they'll definitely get people following them hopefully and and then in turn you know people will come to the game as well because they'll follow them for you know I know people who follow Charlie don't even even watch rugby but they follow out because they like her and then that's made them go hang on a minute she's playing let's see what it's about and you know like I said it's it's another avenue into getting more people into the game so which is an untapped avenue I think

Carl (1:05:35)
Hmm.

Yeah, yeah.

completely agree.

So going back to the challenge, obviously this is gonna be your fifth world record once you've smashed it, as you will. Do you sit up every night just reading the Guinness World Records back to back, like cover to cover, just to figure out what the next one's gonna be? Is the next few already planned or is this a case of just get this one done and we're on to the next? Or have you got to focus and say, I'm gonna do this many by this?

Lexi (1:06:06)
Yes. I'd say.

Hehehehehe

Yeah.

Carl (1:06:30)
this sort of time or...

Lexi (1:06:33)
The records actually came about, they existed for the men, but no women had ever done them before. So when I got them, was just, it's okay, so I'm doing this event, let's have a look and see if the record exists. And it didn't, it didn't mean I just got it because I don't, they actually based your record on 12 % of whatever the male time is, they take 12 % off and that's what you've got to get. And whereas for this one, nobody's ever done it. So I'll be the first person, male or female, to get a record in this.

Carl (1:06:40)
well.

right, okay.

Lexi (1:07:03)
they've given me a time that I've got to do anyway. So I've got to do it in the 45 days. And, and, you know, so that's what I'll do. But yes, so yeah, I actually have, I have a book, which I'm in, but I don't actually look at it to be honest. Not that sad. That sounds really bad. Sorry, Guinness. It sounds really bad. Nothing bad about the Guinness book. It's amazing.

Carl (1:07:05)
Yeah.

No safe, no safe.

Lexi (1:07:33)
Yeah, so I've got loads more planned next year. It depends on sort of sponsors, whether if I can retain some sponsors and maybe get some new ones, then there's a much bigger challenge that I'd like to do. it's almost 5000 kilometres, which I'd intend to do back to back, so on back to back days. So basically, it's in America, I'll say that. So it just depends. And again, it will be to carry on promoting

Women's rugby internationally promotes it in America and promotes it in other countries and carrying it on that way. I've got other ideas. I've probably got a list of about 15 different challenges at the moment. I pretty much know already that they've never been done from a female perspective. It's just a thing that women don't really do. few men do it, but not that many. But not many women do stuff in a non -sport chair.

Carl (1:08:02)
Yeah.

Wow.

Wow.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:08:32)
which is again, something that I'm trying to sort of change and trying to say to people that you don't need to spend 60 grand on a wheelchair to do sport. So if you've got a pair of trainers, you'll go for a run. You've already got your trainers there, that's your legs, use it. You know, can call doing a 5K down your local club or something like that and be active. And it makes so much benefit to gain from being active. know, positive mindset or the kind of thing that sports give you.

Carl (1:08:39)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:09:01)
and that will give you the same thing. you know, hopefully more people will take it up, crossed. Hopefully not overtake me, but you know.

Carl (1:09:02)
Yeah, I agree.

So obviously those challenges you've set a target. Have you got sort of an idea of how quickly you want to do them or is it based on sponsorships, et cetera? Is it a case of you've got to find the right people to bring in to help promote that? Or is it a case of you could actively go, is there some of them that you could just go out and just crack on? Because as you said, you've got to have this recorded.

Is that correct? You basically record every bit of this to prove to the Guinness World Records that you've done it.

Lexi (1:09:39)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. it's quite strict on the sort of the monitoring front. So because they know that anyone could just chuck a Garmin in a car or put it on a bike and then, you know, take the photos and a few strategic points on the way or even Photoshop it. And, you know, it could easily be faked. So, yeah, I've got to film that.

Carl (1:09:53)
Mm -hmm.

Sorry, how fast do you go in this wheelchair if you think that to easily be faked? Because I'd hope the police have started pulling people over if they started moving at a certain speed just with a gun. I'm trying to beat the land world record, the record from John O 'Groats. So what is your target speed?

Lexi (1:10:10)
All right.

Yeah.

Yeah, I don't think they even look at the speed to be honest, they look at more work. So basically I've got a hand in GPS sort of tracking for everything. I've got to be filmed for at least a few minutes every hour. I've got to hand in receipts from literally everywhere that I go. I've got to have photos everywhere that I go. Any media coverage or anything like that helps.

Carl (1:10:24)
Okay.

Bye.

Lexi (1:10:51)
there's lots of other paperwork that I've got to have witness statements from literally everyone that I see. They'll be getting a bit of paper chucked at them saying, can you please sign that? So you've seen me. And that compiles into thousands of pages of evidence that they look at. they can still say no if I've missed one timeframe or I haven't put in enough video or something like that. So I'm going to be filming most of it. Just a couple of basic. Yeah.

Carl (1:10:59)
Wow.

Yeah.

So, have you got like a dash cam on one of the sports, the support vehicles, is that gonna be the sort

Lexi (1:11:21)
Yeah, and I've got a tiny little camera that I've put a battery pack under my chair and it's going to be on my track wheel. So people will get the view that I get and they'll be able to see pretty much what I see. And then it'll be sort of looped and, you know, sort of sped up a little bit. Otherwise, no one's going to sit there and watch four hours of scenery. So it'll be sped up a little bit so people can see what I'm seeing each day. So it'll be quite good fun.

Carl (1:11:27)
well.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Wow, so is that going to be live streamed or are going to just try and edit and speed it up and then release it sort of every day or?

Lexi (1:11:52)
Yeah, it's going to be edited. that my actual route will be live. So just got a Garmin that does live. you can see the route live. So that's going to be live from the minute I set off. So every time I'm wheeling, people can see exactly where I am in the country. And then I'm going do videos at the end of each day as well. So I'll be talking people through what's happened today.

Carl (1:11:53)
Bye.

Okay. Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:12:19)
and then, know, uploading footage and stuff like that. So there's going to be lots of information out there so people can see what it's actually like. And I tend not to hold back that much when it comes to exactly what things are like. So they'll get an honest account of what things are really like, sort of wheeling it from a normal wheelchair perspective. I actually thought someone must have done it in a sport chair, but they haven't either. So that surprised me. But yeah, so, yes.

Carl (1:12:31)
Yeah

So.

Lexi (1:12:49)
It's the unknown, but it's going to be fun.

Carl (1:12:50)
So are you gonna have sort of gloves and stuff like that? Have you got certain kit that you've got to wear? you got that all prepped? there, well, I'm guessing, have you got like a padded chair and stuff like that? Is there anything, like, enough that you're just gonna go, what?

Lexi (1:13:07)
No, no, It's literally everything on the wheelchair has to be as it is commercially available. So there's no adaptions. It's literally just a box standard. In fact, I chose a wheelchair that has got no flashy bits on it at all. It's as basic as you can get. mean, my chair has, it doesn't actually have brakes either, no wheelchair does. So that's going to be fun going downhill. It has what kind of like handbrakes. So when you stop, you can put on a brake that stops you moving backwards and forwards.

Carl (1:13:12)
Standard.

Right.

Lexi (1:13:37)
but you kind of flick it on with your thumbs. So it's a bit difficult to do that when you're going down a large hill. yeah, it's like, get your thumbs caught in the wheels. But yeah, so I've got gloves that it's taken me ages to find the right pair. And they're basically just them ones that people use. Like if they work in Tesco's and they work in the freezer department, they're like thermal gloves and they're waterproof. So it's just them. And then I find they protect my hands. So my hands are...

Carl (1:13:38)
Right.

Just tough.

Yeah.

okay. Yeah. Wow. Mm

Lexi (1:14:05)
almost callus -free. But they've lasted through the past few years of lots of training. So they're doing all right so far. So think I'll probably get through about 50 odd pairs of gloves, depending on the weather.

Carl (1:14:06)
Yeah.

Yeah, I can imagine. So what is the weather? Are you expecting a bit of deluge of rain or are you thinking there's going to be a little bit of sunshine in there to try and make it a bit? Because obviously coming down from Scotland, you could have any season of weather up there most of the days and I think even getting to the furthest point of Cornwall.

Lexi (1:14:26)
Yeah.

I know.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Carl (1:14:42)
sort of has its own climate some days as well. Then you can have four seasons in a day down there. have you, is it a case of you just chuck a rain jacket on and just crack on? Wow.

Lexi (1:14:46)
Definitely.

Yeah, literally. I've gone through loads of different waterproofs and I found out that no waterproof is waterproof. So it's a poncho. So literally one of the throwaway ponchos are the best that seem to work quite well. So I just chuck one of those on and carry on. I mean, if it's torrential, then I might stop, but chances are I'll probably just carry on. I do it in training anyway.

There's no reason not to. The sooner you've got to where you need to be, the sooner you can stop and get dry anyway. The way I see it is I look at it again from a rugby perspective. If start chucking it down in a game, the girls carry on. So if they can do it, I'll give it a go. I'm not as tough as they are, but I'll still give it a go. I'll put myself in their shoes a little bit.

Carl (1:15:18)
No.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, it's amazing. So is there any other sort of precautions? Does the chair react differently to the rain? Is it a little bit harder to sort of push or steer? You've obviously had to train in all weathers to figure out what your chair can do. Is there any bits that you probably think actually...

Lexi (1:15:58)
Yeah.

Carl (1:16:08)
I'm going to probably shit myself doing it in that sort of weather or going down a hill in snow or sleet. That will probably think, hold on, this is not the greatest thing I've thought about. But once you get to the bottom, you crack on. is there, what's the bits that sort of concern you, shall we say?

Lexi (1:16:12)
Yeah.

Hills in the rain, definitely. So going up them and down them. So my gloves normally got a little bit of a grip on them. And then when it rains, your hands slip like mad. And when you're going up a really steep hill, you eventually have to lean forward and then you're pulling or pushing your whole body weight plus the chair against gravity going uphill. So it's like doing press ups with someone on your back over and over again. So then you add the fact that your hands are slipping on top of that.

Carl (1:16:26)
Yeah.

Alright.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:16:53)
and you risk an injury and it just makes it absolutely exhausting. The last time I did a small hill in like horrible rain, my forearms were, yeah, they were just burning like mad for ages afterwards. So yeah, that's not the greatest thing. And then likewise going downhill, you have to hold on for dear life and just hope that you don't let go and your gloves, you kind of like start smelling burning, your gloves start burning and stuff and then that goes through to your hands. But in the rain, you get the opposite where you can't grab hold enough and you're slipping like mad.

Carl (1:17:09)
Yeah.

Lexi (1:17:23)
You're kind of just hurtling down the hill at, know, of 30 -odd kilometers an hour and hoping that the hill stops at some point before you find a brick wall or something.

Carl (1:17:31)
Does one of the support vehicles go in front on that sort of hill situation or they just watch you from behind and then just pick you up wherever you've ended up if that's what happens? wow.

Lexi (1:17:38)
No, that's not... Yeah, that's not playback.

Pretty much, yeah. But the record, I'm not allowed to be helped in any way at any point. So yeah, they've got to stay well back. Yeah, so if I just go off on one, they'll probably be like, I can put my foot to the floor a little bit. I'll be like driving Miss Daisy behind me for the rest of time.

Carl (1:17:48)
okay. So they can't go in front of me. Wow.

Yeah.

So you can't use any sort of grip aids, sort of anything like that. You can't spray the sort of the glue stuff that rugby players use on, because there's a lot of lads at grassroots rugby that have got no hands pretty much. So they spray this glue on to try and help them. You can't use any of that. It's literally fully unmodified. it?

Lexi (1:18:18)
Yeah.

didn't even know that existed actually but no I presume not. yeah, literally everything's got to be as natural as possible.

Carl (1:18:28)
No. Obviously that's on your gloves, not on your wheelchair though, so it might be a loophole, you never know. Yeah.

Lexi (1:18:38)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, like worth looking at that could be, could be frankly, and a little bit helps and all that. But, but yeah, yeah, so the chair is just literally as simple as it can possibly be. And the, the, the, when I first did my first record, the track wheel wasn't acknowledged at all. And now they started acknowledging it in the records and my last one had front wheel written next to it, which is not, but it just basically indicates that I've got a

Carl (1:18:46)
Wow, yeah.

Bye.

Lexi (1:19:06)
you know, boxed out of the wheelchair with this front wheel on the front. acknowledging that as well, which is fair enough. So it's there. It doesn't actually help particularly, but you know, it's just, like I said, sort of, it makes things harder because you're adding weight to everything. So it adds to like about six kilos. So when you go into the hill, you really notice that six kilos. But again, it just stops me from dragging myself out of the chair, which I tend to do a lot otherwise.

Carl (1:19:07)
Right.

Hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So obviously alongside that as well, have you got to be registered disabled as well to be able to claim that record? Or could you be able bodied and jump in a wheelchair and attempt it? is it, okay.

Lexi (1:19:49)
Yeah, I presume so. So I've never been asked for any proof, put it that way, that I'm disabled. I suppose mine's quite obvious, but yeah, yeah, just the one leg and the other one flopping away there. yeah, so yeah, they've never actually said anything, but yeah, I presume that you could just point yourself in a chair if you wanted to. I mean, if you really wanted to. It's...

Carl (1:19:54)
Well, your missing leg was probably a surprise, but you never...

Yeah, I can imagine.

Lexi (1:20:18)
Really tough, it that way. So we did a challenge. I took my chair at the launch event and we took it with like some tracks so you can get rollers for the chair. Awesome company called Evictus do these rollers that you put your chair on. it's bit like, same as when you go on bike rollers. So I took those along so people could actually have a go on the chair and see what it was like. So I wheeled for 30 seconds. And I didn't go massively flat out. just sort of went at

Carl (1:20:25)
Yeah.

Yeah. Okay.

Yeah.

Wow.

Lexi (1:20:47)
nice pace because I thought, you know, the idea was that people can beat me. But yeah, you had it like, the like, a load of the Chiefs women came on and had a go and a load of people in the audience came in and had a go as well. And they were all sort of going hell for leather. And we got two people actually equaled my time, which was really awesome. amazing player, Emily Tosie, who plays for Canada and Chiefs as well. And a chap that works in BYD.

Carl (1:20:49)
Yep.

Wow.

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. wow.

Lexi (1:21:15)
So cars, the BYD cars that's my support car. They've been awesome. They've sponsored me for the support car, which is really cool. And yeah, they all got to have a go and feel what it was like. their response was like, just 30 seconds is really tough. How do you keep going for hours? And it's like, yeah, it's really hard. Normally you use your legs to walk around and your muscles and your legs are quite big and that's what they're there for. They're accustomed to moving in from A to B.

Carl (1:21:21)
Yeah, that's what I'm gonna do.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:21:45)
Even though running is tough and you have to build up to it, but that's what you, you know, your legs are conditioned to do that and accept that. But your upper body really isn't. So you have to retrain your upper body into being your legs essentially, and accepting the fact that you've got to do repetition over and over and over again and your body be okay with that. Which it never really is, but you kind of just pretend that it is and it's fine. It won't.

Carl (1:21:51)
Mm.

Yeah.

No.

So what's your training schedule look like? Is there a lot of bench press and stuff like that? Or is it just predominantly in the wheelchair, just getting, because there's different, obviously I'm guessing there's fast Twitch fibers that you probably have to break down by using the wheels all the time. There's different, obviously as you said, you've got an amazing coach that's pretty much nailed your training plan. How has that broken down?

Lexi (1:22:30)
Yeah.

Yes, I do. So I've got the three marathons that I'll do. One of them tends to be faster than the other two. One encompasses hills, so I do quite a lot of hills on one and then one's a little bit slower. Then I'll do normally a couple of hours on the track. So I'll do like an interval session on the track and then I go straight to the gym and then at the gym, like the sleds, you know, a lot in rugby. I'll use a strap on one of those and put it around my stomach.

Carl (1:22:34)
Mm -hmm.

Yeah.

Mm -hmm.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Lexi (1:23:02)
And then I'll tow about 60 kilos and I'll like wheel with that. So it simulates going up really steep hills. And then it's things like, you know, just normal exercise like that pull down. I'll do a lot, a lot of shoulder work. So shoulder presses, lateral raises, things like that. So lots of stuff for your shoulders. even stuff, stuff, my biceps as well. Cause I'll use those quite a bit from going around corners, you pull one hand and push with the other. So you actually use biceps quite a bit. quite a bit of tricep works when you're pushing.

Carl (1:23:06)
Wow.

Yeah.

Yeah.

well.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:23:31)
up a hill, it's mainly a chest and triceps that take the brunt of that. So there's quite a bit of chest work in there as well. So yeah, bench press. So I'm doing like at the moment I'm doing single arm dumbbell presses. It isolates one side of the chest and then the other, which is quite helpful. So yeah, everything just sort of to mimic the movement that I'm doing, but adding extra weight to it. I even do weights on my leg, on the leg that is okay. But to keep some strength there. And I actually use that quite a lot when I go around corners.

Carl (1:23:39)
Yep.

Wow.

Yeah.

I was going to say is that sort of a balance as well? You naturally always get like, usually when my missus is driving the car, I'm always trying to brake on the other side. It's a similar thing. Your legs, even though they're not in use, they still feel like they're part of it, don't they? Do you get a similar feeling through the leg that you've had amputated? Does your body feel like it needs to do the same or is it past the point that it doesn't have that sort of reception?

Lexi (1:24:00)
So.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, literally.

Yeah.

No, it still does. so my left leg is a lot smaller than my right one. It kind of looks a bit bizarre because it's really small. So the muscle mass is kind of like wasted away. Yeah, it still tries, but it's trying to get me around corners, but it doesn't quite work. So I kind of like find myself leaning a lot when I have to like go up to the right and then I breeze around the left. And it's quite unique. You just kind of have to train your body to accept the fact that it's going to do a little bit, but yeah, it can't do a lot.

Carl (1:24:32)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Wow.

Lexi (1:24:58)
So there's no foot attachments, you can't use it that well. So a bit of a pain.

Carl (1:25:00)
No. So the, obviously the gym, you just said that you go to the gym. Have they had to adapt for the chair or do you just sort of, you're able to just jump on the normal, like the lat pull down is obviously usually a fixed machine in most gyms. Have you got an adapted one or do you just sort of jump off your chair and onto the machine and make best use of what's in front of you? Wow.

Lexi (1:25:23)
Yeah, just jump off. Yeah, literally. So just jump off and on. So when I had my leg off one of the likes, I live in a first floor apartment with no lift. we thought about moving and it was like, actually I really like where I live. I didn't want to change it. So I thought, well, how can I change, you know, being independent from where I am and carry on being independent? So I found a way of getting my chair down the stairs, just by kind of like, kind of like crawl.

Carl (1:25:32)
I should do.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:25:52)
pretty much and just like let the chair sort of lead you down the stairs and then pull it back up the stairs. there's, just finding different ways to do things. Which I mean, some days I can't do it. So if pain's really bad, it makes it tough. But most of time I can be pretty much independent and I'll, you know, I go up in the lift and into the gym, wheel around. There's not a lot that can't do other than the treadmill. That's a bit tricky, but could look a bit bizarre as well, hopping away on the treadmill.

Carl (1:25:56)
Wow.

Yeah.

Wow.

You could use two of them, use two treadmills next to each other with your chair.

Lexi (1:26:20)
Yeah, I could try that. That'd be quite fun. See if they let me do that next time I go. But yeah, most care. I'm quite lucky that the gym's quite good. It's got handbikes and stuff like that. And I use the rower quite a lot. So I warm up on the rower, just using one leg and it works. It's yeah, mean, most things you can adapt to you. It's just about being a bit creative and yeah, kind of

Carl (1:26:29)
Yeah. Wow. Get.

Amazing.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:26:49)
changing things to suit you a little bit and it works.

Carl (1:26:51)
What's been the hardest bit to adapt to then?

Lexi (1:26:56)
I think that for me was not walking. that's still a tough thing for me to, so I don't think I'll ever accept the fact that I can't walk. So after my surgeries, I've had like 20 surgeries so far. And after my event, six days later, I've got a pre -op for another surgery on my nerves in my leg. And hopefully they can have a chance of fixing those nerves. And if they can fix them,

Carl (1:26:59)
Yeah.

to

Lexi (1:27:25)
then I could potentially wear a prosthetic for maybe up to 20 % of the time, but because of the pain condition, I can't wear it all the time and I won't be able to wear it. I won't be able to just walk with a prosthetic. I'll probably have to have crutches as well. And that'll be for like a very small period of time. But yeah, that bit is most difficult because I think I keep sort of asking the doctors whether I could try it again and have an amputation again and go higher and see if that would get rid of the pain condition so I could be

Carl (1:27:30)
Hmm.

Mm

Mmm.

Lexi (1:27:55)
mobile all the time and I could actually wear prosthetic. And then I sort of thought about, you know, the wheelchair side of things, would I carry on doing what I'm doing? And so I would actually, I want to carry on doing what I'm doing because I'm hopefully going to, you know, hopefully help some people. So I would still carry on doing that regardless. Because at that point, when you're above knee, you quite often need to use a on occasion anyway. Because when you're an amputee,

Carl (1:28:16)
Yeah.

Lexi (1:28:21)
lots of people think that you can wear prosthetic all the time. And even if you've got no problems, you still get problems like rubbing and you get blisters and things like that that happen. And especially if you're stupid and wear it a lot, which is probably what I do. So I'd probably end up in a wheelchair from time to time anyway, so it'd be fine. But yeah, so that's a really tough side for me. it's like anybody, you take walking away from you, you want to be able to walk again.

Carl (1:28:21)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Lexi (1:28:50)
And I've got a chance there of doing it, so hopefully. So I'll keep plugging away until hopefully they say yes at one point. That'll be nice.

Carl (1:28:58)
I was going to say, have you already started eyeing up world records that haven't been completed by somebody with a prosthetic? Is there you, I've already got one eye, that's it, I've nailed it. If I've got to settle for walking again, I'm going to go for all of these.

Lexi (1:29:04)
I'm sorry.

Yeah, yeah, I don't know. Yeah, yeah, I've kind of had a little think maybe. Just a little one. Well, three, we'll see what happens.

Carl (1:29:20)
Amazing. Lexi, this has been an absolute revelation. It's been an amazing conversation. You're an absolute amazing person for what you're doing, to spread the word about the game and just doing what you're doing, just being out, just so positive about everyday challenges. Like my back hurts occasionally. I got a bit of sciatica from playing rugby. thought it was bad day some days, but you seem to be absolutely smashing life with so many challenges in front of you and you just...

bashing down walls everywhere. So it's been an absolute honor to have you on and thank you so much. And obviously we're going to promote as much as we can across all socials and keep in touch with you throughout the bit so we can share people where you're to be on what days and everything like that. And hopefully share that and push that as much forward because it's a well -worthy cause and being carried out by such an amazing person. Thank you so much for your time.

Lexi (1:29:54)
Thank you.

Yeah, we'll do different.

Thank you.

Thank you so much. It's been absolutely amazing talking to you.

Carl (1:30:21)
Brilliant, thank you Lexi, let's keep in touch, let's get this promoted as much as we can.

Lexi (1:30:28)
Yeah, can I just say if people want to have a look at their website, it's called n2n .org .uk. So just end with the two in the middle and then end .org .uk. And then it tells them basically what I've told you. So it'll tell them all about the challenge and where they can go to donate and where they can see me, hopefully. So in a few days time, it's quite scary. thank you. Thank you so much.

Carl (1:30:45)
Yeah.

Yeah, it's amazing. Brilliant. Cheers, Lexi. Thank you.

Rugby Through The Leagues (1:30:55)
Well that episode comes to an end. Thanks for everyone that's watched all the way through. I know it was a long one but there was plenty to fit in. Great, great guest again. Next week we are going actually out into the field with, we've got a little bit of a...

turn up we're going down to Gosport, we're going to go watch their last pre -season game over at Millbrook, get it all readied and get that released before the first season game on the 7th. We've got a little bit to go out in the field and we're going up to Newbury on Friday night as well to watch their game against Swindon.

Millbrook are over there as well, so with some amazing bits we're actually getting out and seeing the grass roots and getting some real live interviews. So the next episode is going to be a little bit of a mismatch of interviews with different people, but it'll be raw and out there and actually out in the field to understand the day -to -day battles.

of Grassroots Rugby and those that make it click so yeah can't wait for that one and we'll also be announcing the new competition that's coming up as well so watch out on the socials for that so there is a nice new competition coming up for us as well so thank you for everyone that's joined really appreciate it keep safe, ciao.